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Thread: Small split shot vs. sinking line

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    Default Small split shot vs. sinking line

    I'd like to do some nymph fishing on some of the lakes and I'm wondering if it works to use a small split shot vs a sinking line to get the depth that I want?

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    Umm. What depth? That kind of nymph? What kind of retrieval technique?

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    Default Depth and type.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Fleming View Post
    Umm. What depth? That kind of nymph? What kind of retrieval technique?
    Anywhere from 6 - 12 ft.

    Dragonfly nymphs, leeches.

    Slow, hand twist/stripping retrieve.

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    Personally, I'd go buy a 12ft sink tip section that you can loop to the end of your floating line. Cheap, and you'll get a lot better presentation and animation. You could theoretically do 6 feet. The problem in the length of time and quality of presentation you could have 'in the zone'. Your actual 'fishing time' would be extremely compromised.

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    Default Agreed

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Fleming View Post
    Personally, I'd go buy a 12ft sink tip section that you can loop to the end of your floating line. Cheap, and you'll get a lot better presentation and animation. You could theoretically do 6 feet. The problem in the length of time and quality of presentation you could have 'in the zone'. Your actual 'fishing time' would be extremely compromised.
    Would you recommend the 12 ft sink tip section vs. purchasing an entire spool of sinking line?

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    It really depends how often you are going to use it and to what depth. If its just as you described, it would work fine.

    I'm getting back into lake fishing, but when I used too, I wouldn't be on the lake without a floating, intermediate, and full sinking lines. And a spare spool for each and it is a substantial investment.

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    Default That's the direction I'm headed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Fleming View Post
    It really depends how often you are going to use it and to what depth. If its just as you described, it would work fine.

    I'm getting back into lake fishing, but when I used too, I wouldn't be on the lake without a floating, intermediate, and full sinking lines. And a spare spool for each and it is a substantial investment.
    I already have the floating so I think my next step is to purchase an extra spool and go with the intermediate sinking line.

    By-the-way, what is the difference between an intermediate sinking line and a full sinking line? Is the intermediate the sinking tip that you speak of?

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    An intermediate is a very slowing sinking line. 1" to 1 3/4" per second. I prefer a stealthy clear intermediate. Effective between 2" to 4" under the surface. Great for fishing emergers and especially chironimids. A slight kick or breeze in the float tube will keep it right in that zone. By letting in sink to depth, a slight kick with make it rise in the water column, this IS the trigger in some types of fishing.

    I'd probably start with a class 3 Full-sink line. These are effective at about 5 to 15 feet below the surface. This will be more verstitle for you and will work perfect in the type of presentation and depth you are taking about.

    A 'sink-tip' is an advantage in moving water, so a recovery/recast is easier to make. It does leave a "belly" in the line though.

    One of the keys to lake fishing, especially with emergers/nymphs is keeping a tight line. The take (and spit out) can be super delicate. Thats one of the problems fishing with with a floating line and lead, you don't have that direct connection to your bug. A ton of takes (and hookups) are missed by not having that tight line. By designing your presentation to be a direct connection between your hand and your fly, i'll guarantee you'll see your success rate go way up.

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    Correction: Intermediate 2 to 4 feet under the surface

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    Default Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Fleming View Post
    An intermediate is a very slowing sinking line. 1" to 1 3/4" per second. I prefer a stealthy clear intermediate. Effective between 2" to 4" under the surface. Great for fishing emergers and especially chironimids. A slight kick or breeze in the float tube will keep it right in that zone. By letting in sink to depth, a slight kick with make it rise in the water column, this IS the trigger in some types of fishing.

    I'd probably start with a class 3 Full-sink line. These are effective at about 5 to 15 feet below the surface. This will be more verstitle for you and will work perfect in the type of presentation and depth you are taking about.

    A 'sink-tip' is an advantage in moving water, so a recovery/recast is easier to make. It does leave a "belly" in the line though.

    One of the keys to lake fishing, especially with emergers/nymphs is keeping a tight line. The take (and spit out) can be super delicate. Thats one of the problems fishing with with a floating line and lead, you don't have that direct connection to your bug. A ton of takes (and hookups) are missed by not having that tight line. By designing your presentation to be a direct connection between your hand and your fly, i'll guarantee you'll see your success rate go way up.
    Thanks for all of the information Mike; it's been very helpful.

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    No problem. Just remember that getting your gear to a depth is easy. Keeping it there and making in behave like the natural is the key to success. You can easily strip it right out of the zone.

    Later

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    Kinda depends on what you're used to and what you expect. I find it real easy to get drag-free drifts with the shot or beadheads, but a PITA with sinking lines, even short sinktips. But then, I've been mending lines to control drifts for over 50 years, and no amount of surface mending will take all the drag out of a sinking line for me. YMMV.

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    Mike thanks for going the forum nice to have your input. Yellowstone as an option you can contact J. Teeny he is very approachable and willing to share his insight just food for thought. 503.667.6602 he also has contact data via email at his web site just google Jim Teeny his web site will come up.

    Tight Lines
    BMR

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    Thanks for all of the input from everyone here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yellowstone View Post
    I'd like to do some nymph fishing on some of the lakes and I'm wondering if it works to use a small split shot vs a sinking line to get the depth that I want?
    No, split shot will not work/catch fish in the situation you describe (lake nymphing, 6-12 ft); use full sink line (not sink tip).

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    ive had great success fishing small nymphs and scuds for trout at 12ff deep with floating line and split shot. i rarely would use sinking line so i never bought it. i'd just slip on a split shot a foot-foot and a half above the fly and let er sink. usually using a long leader and tippet around 12 ft the tip of your floating line wont go under and will almost work as a strike indicator. id just slow strip a few inches at a time and worked great. keep in mind this is only in lakes. not sure how current would effect this.

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    Scientific Anglers and RIO both make a good line called a versi-tip or quad tip. They are a main floating line with four separate tips. A fast sink, a medium sink, a clear intermediate, and a floating tip in a handy leader wallet. They're kinda spendy but alot easier to change tips out of a float tube in the middle of a lake than trying to change out spools and re-string your rod (much faster too). Also saves having to buy extra spools for your reel. Before I got one I had a floating line and a type 3 sink tip and that covered most lake fishing situations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMCOD View Post
    Scientific Anglers and RIO both make a good line called a versi-tip or quad tip. They are a main floating line with four separate tips. A fast sink, a medium sink, a clear intermediate, and a floating tip in a handy leader wallet. They're kinda spendy but alot easier to change tips out of a float tube in the middle of a lake than trying to change out spools and re-string your rod (much faster too). Also saves having to buy extra spools for your reel. Before I got one I had a floating line and a type 3 sink tip and that covered most lake fishing situations.
    I have used these (RIO). Unfortunately, the loop connecters hung up pretty bad on the rod I was using. (Sage VXP). Others have few roblems. I preferred to add a sink tip when needed for a cost of about $12 to my choice in floating line. That way there was no compromise when fishing just the tloating line. Add to your favorite line. You can cut up any old appropriate fly line, add loop connectors, and have your own 'system'. If you are an occasional depth hunter. These options are both 'practical'.

    That being said, for me, there's nothing 'practical' about fly-fishing, and I now succumb to 'buy once; cry once'. I've had more satisfaction knowing I'm using the best tool for the job, and I have moved past the trial and error phase. In the end, shortcuts usually end up costing me more money. Having fished both, I guarantee I can swap spools in the same time (or less) as it took to coil up a versi-tip and put it away. Either way, if you don't have the time, you probably are on a different pace than I am. I enjoy all the aspects of flyfishing. Even putting the boots on and straightening the leader.

    They're lots of 'systems' people use and that's ok. Let's face it, you could probably use a 2x2, some twine, a bell sinker, and a dental floss tippet and catch a fish. Most of it is what you want out of it. Just realize its all a compromise. One gun could possibly cover most of your hunting needs. Although it might be a little awkward and uncomfortable at times. .

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    Funny thing concerning the SI and the Rio as Mike pointed out no need in fact back in 1989 Orvis had a similar option and I purchaced :-( seem like a good idea at the time becuase I was doing a lot of lake fishing. Two years later I started making my own from various lines on sale had them from 2ft to 20ft I know Silly Moose but hey trial and error was half the fun.

    Spool swaping if it is an affordable option is the way to go. Sorry Mike I know I am just repeating what you said.

    Bottom Line talk to Teeny ask him about his system how and why he came up with it and skip the RIO and SI option they are only duplicates of a tried and trusted product that is available i.e. Teeny Lines.

    Tight Lines and again Mike thanks for joinging the forum and your insight.

    BMR

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    Excuse me but with all due respect I really find it hard to believe that you can swap spools and re-string your rod faster(and easier) than you can change a tip and put it away while out on a lake in a float tube. And yes the connectors may not slide through your guides as easy as a regular sink tip line, I find it's much easier to carry a leader wallet (provided with the tips) than it is to carry around 3 extra spools. When I'm fishing from a boat and have plenty of room I just bring extra rods rigged with different lines. Lately I'm at a point in my life where I don't have alot of time to fish so when I do get out on the water I like to spend it actually fishing. People have different aspects of fishing that they really enjoy and that's OK.

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