Looking for a Ruger Bisley....

[Paul H]

Why don't you start a post titled I don't like NM SBH's and bisleys vs. clogging up Snyd's with your disdain? Your comments add nothing to his search for a bisley nor discussing custom 5 shot Linebaughs.

[Whitworth]

I got my first Ruger SA - a Super Blackhawk around 45 years ago. I've still got the .44 Blackhawk I carried when I came to Alaska over 30 years ago - it was the best lightweight .44 I could find in the days before the .454s. . A couple of weeks ago I picked up a nice .45 7 1/2" Blackhawk convertiable - my other .45 Blackhawk is the 4" barrel and I thought it would be nice to have other barrel length. I obviously have nothering against Rugers SAs!

Like a vast number of other shooters I much prefer the Old Models- I find the un-modified actions and cylinder operation superior to the new ones. A similar situation exists with the locks and MIM parts on the new S&Ws - I don't especially care for either of them- new S&Ws or NM Rugers - but it doesn't totally turn me off on the new guns nor do I hold eihter of them in disdain.

The use of the NM Bisleys is rather obvious: product liability and the shape and steel material of the grip frame. A manufacturer would be crazy to use anything else. The Linebaugh conversion does modify the stupid one way cylinder rotation of the NM to allow better loading and unloading - I don't know about the others.

Did you check link I posted earlier where John Linebaugh stated he considers the Colt SA a superior packable carry gun compared to the Ruger and likes the S&W 25 better than either for a packabe gun? Do you think John knows what he is talking about?

I know John Linebaugh and speak to him regularly. You didn't know who he was until someone mentioned him here. This was a discussion about a suitable platform for a custom conversion and you have managed to derail this thread with your Ruger hatred.

[Whitworth]

Did you check link I posted earlier where John Linebaugh stated he considers the Colt SA a superior packable carry gun compared to the Ruger and likes the S&W 25 better than either for a packabe gun? Do you think John knows what he is talking about?

It's lighter and smaller -- hence the more "packable" assertion.

[tvfinak]

While the Colt SAs are lighter the S&W 625-5 is about the same weight as the Ruger Blackhawk.

John also explains that the S&W .45 Colts loads hare plenty powerfull enough to do the job on anything he may encounter. If a pistol doesn't have the punch it isn't much good no matter how light it is.

But we divert from the topic at hand!

Next time you talk to John can you ask him if he has ever converted an old model?

It's lighter and smaller -- hence the more "packable" assertion.

[.338-06]

I know John Linebaugh and speak to him regularly. You didn't know who he was until someone mentioned him here.

Isn't this a bit harsh? I don't know John Linebaugh, nor do I speak to him regularly, but I've known of him for many years. I'm sure tvfinak has heard of him before this thread. If you don't want to read his posts, use the ignore feature.

[Whitworth]

Isn't this a bit harsh? I don't know John Linebaugh, nor do I speak to him regularly, but I've known of him for many years. I'm sure tvfinak has heard of him before this thread. If you don't want to read his posts, use the ignore feature.

If you knew the history of this back and forth, you wouldn't judge this as a harsh response, but one rooted in reality. tv never fails to rain on every Ruger parade possible.

If it offended anyone else, my apologies, but when the moderator started a thread seeking to discuss the platform for his planned custom conversion, it didn't take long for tvfinak to derail it.

[Murphy]

This is what he said.


The toughest and best built by far are the Ruger Blackhawks and Bisleys.........


Mod 25-5 in .45 Colt.
This gun has a few drawbacks but they can be worked around or repaired to the point that.........

We recommend handloads for the Rugers single action in .45 Colt caliber to 32,000 PSI levels.
While the S&W will take these loads safely such loads will greatly shorten the life of your gun. The frames on S&W are not heat treated thus are pretty soft. With loads that exceed what the gun can comfortably handle the frame stretches immediately lengthwise and then springs back. This all causes battering and soon your gun has excessive endshake. I don't know how long it takes to wreck a N frame S&W with heavy handloads but Jeff Cooper printed one time he saw a model 29 go out in the realm of 1,000 hot handloads if I remember correctly. I would agree that serious damage could be done in this amount of shooting with too heavy a handload.

[Whitworth]

This is what he said.


The toughest and best built by far are the Ruger Blackhawks and Bisleys.........


Mod 25-5 in .45 Colt.
This gun has a few drawbacks but they can be worked around or repaired to the point that.........

No, Murphy, you need to go back a lot farther than that. That was the straw that broke the proverbial back for me, and a diversion from the original topic.

My apologies again, if I offended anyone else.

[Murphy]

No, Murphy, you need to go back a lot farther than that. That was the straw that broke the proverbial back for me, and a diversion from the original topic.

My apologies again, if I offended anyone else.

Yes I know. No apology needed here. I've known John for about 30 years. We do agree on many subjects.

[Whitworth]

Murphy, check your PMs.

[tvfinak]

This is what John said line for line with nothing left out; the editing changed the meaning substaintly bold emphasis by me

"The toughest and best built by far are the Ruger Blackhawks and Bisleys. These are fine hunting and utility guns and in 4-3/4" barrel length make what could be considered by many the ultimate packing gun.
The Colt SAA and New Frontiers are the ultimate packers and offer power levels with safe handloads to handle any game in the lower 48 states. The price of the base Colt keeps lots of shooters from enjoying these fine guns.

One of the best priced and balanced packing power packages we have today is the Smith and Wesson Mod 25-5 in .45 Colt. This gun has a few drawbacks but they can be worked around or repaired to the point that in my opinion, it becomes my favorite all around packin' gun."

You can find the whole thing here: http://www.handloads.com/articles/default.asp?id=12

This is what he said.

The toughest and best built by far are the Ruger Blackhawks and Bisleys.........

Mod 25-5 in .45 Colt.
This gun has a few drawbacks but they can be worked around or repaired to the point that.........

We recommend handloads for the Rugers single action in .45 Colt caliber to 32,000 PSI levels.
While the S&W will take these loads safely such loads will greatly shorten the life of your gun. The frames on S&W are not heat treated thus are pretty soft. With loads that exceed what the gun can comfortably handle the frame stretches immediately lengthwise and then springs back. This all causes battering and soon your gun has excessive endshake. I don't know how long it takes to wreck a N frame S&W with heavy handloads but Jeff Cooper printed one time he saw a model 29 go out in the realm of 1,000 hot handloads if I remember correctly. I would agree that serious damage could be done in this amount of shooting with too heavy a handload.

[Murphy]

I don't understand this????

The New Model Ruger Blackhawk was introduced in 1971. It is no longer new.

Also the guns John and Hamilton Bowen build are new, precision built firearms. They use only primarily just the cylinder frame and grip frame. They are works of art and the utmost in precision. If you've never owned one, you have no idea how smooth a revolver can be. New five shot cylinders are manufactured and obviously all the lock work is changed to index five shots. The reason these guns are used is because they are a very good design and have the strength and durability to handle the heavier calibers.

And it is likely news to you, TV, but the old model had a one way cylinder rotation also just like the Colt SAA's. That isn't something that came with the new models.

[jwp500]

How amazing it is that the ones with the least amount of knowledge an experience post the most.

Snyd you will be be very pleased with a custom revolver in the caliber of your choice. I have known John Linebauh since 1985 and talk with him regularly to exchange infomation.

There are several top builders that you would be very pleased with their work, I know that i have been

[jwp500]

Why don't you start a post titled I don't like NM SBH's and bisleys vs. clogging up Snyd's with your disdain? Your comments add nothing to his search for a bisley nor discussing custom 5 shot Linebaughs.

Just ban the imbecile

[tvfinak]

I'll try to explain: most refer to the New Model Blackhawks as New because they are stamped "New Model" on the side of the frames. While the old models are obviously not stamped "Old Model" the reference to OM or Old Model helps everyone to distinguish the more valuable "Old Models" from the less valuable and less desireable (by many) "New Models".

While the cylinders in the Old Model and Colts only rotate in one direction they will go backwards a bit to line up the cylinder with gate. The cylinders on the New Models are much less user friendly to load and unload. Linebaugh corrects this deficency on his guns: I suspect the others do so also. One should clearly expect precision and exceptional wormanship on a $2500+ gun as well as the features on desires. For me - i'd prefer the Old Model action but I understand for liability reasons it isn't avaliable.

I don't understand this????

The New Model Ruger Blackhawk was introduced in 1971. It is no longer new.

Also the guns John and Hamilton Bowen build are new, precision built firearms. They use only primarily just the cylinder frame and grip frame. They are works of art and the utmost in precision. If you've never owned one, you have no idea how smooth a revolver can be. New five shot cylinders are manufactured and obviously all the lock work is changed to index five shots. The reason these guns are used is because they are a very good design and have the strength and durability to handle the heavier calibers.

And it is likely news to you, TV, but the old model had a one way cylinder rotation also just like the Colt SAA's. That isn't something that came with the new models.

[Murphy]

Do you actually have the audacity to try to explain anything about handguns to Me???

You act as though you have never had any Ruger in your hands!!!! I know how they all work. I disassemble and reassemble old and new Rugers almost daily!! DO NOT ATTEMPT TO TELL ME HOW A REVOLVER WORKS!!

I'll try to explain: most refer to the New Model Blackhawks as New because they are stamped "New Model" on the side of the frames. While the old models are obviously not stamped "Old Model" the reference to OM or Old Model helps everyone to distinguish the more valuable "Old Models" from the less valuable and less desireable (by many) "New Models".

While the cylinders in the Old Model and Colts only rotate in one direction they will go backwards a bit to line up the cylinder with gate. The cylinders on the New Models are much less user friendly to load and unload. Linebaugh corrects this deficency on his guns: I suspect the others do so also. One should clearly expect precision and exceptional wormanship on a $2500+ gun as well as the features on desires. For me - i'd prefer the Old Model action but I understand for liability reasons it isn't avaliable.

[Mike Echo]

Fixing to get interesting now...
Mike

[Snyd]

...and all I wanted to do was spread the word to fellow AOD Handgunners that I was lookin for a Blue Bisley...

[Paul H]

Unfortunately any mention of ruger revolvers seems to be the perfect bait for a certain poster that simply can't control himself regarding his disdain for rugers.

[tvfinak]

I would suspect that you were refering to me EXCEPT for the fact that I own over a dozen Rugers and I just bought a very nice Blackhawk .45 convertable at the last gun show a couple of weeks ago. Perhaps my Ruger ownership and buying should figure into the old saying of "putting your money where your mouth is".

Of course there seems to be a bit of a double standard on this forum- posters can post about S&Ws with non-existing "stretched and twisted" frames, "massive X frames", and the latest locking feature on the S&Ws without showing a "disdain" for S&Ws.

But then again the double standard seem to be more and more common in American life and politics. Perhaps we should all get used to it?

Unfortunately any mention of ruger revolvers seems to be the perfect bait for a certain poster that simply can't control himself regarding his disdain for rugers.