338-06AI with 275grn Speer help

[bigswede358]

I got a hold of some 275 gr Speer .338 cal bullets and would like to shoot some out of my 338-06AI. I'm not sure where to start as far as powder and powder charge. Anybody ever try this combination or know where I could get some help with this. Thanks for your help.
Brent

[swapdonkey]

loaddata.com has a little load data with that bullet for the 338-06.

[back country]

sounds like a waste of time and bullets/powder to me ..... 250's are too heavy for that MV potential

[bigswede358]

Thanks for the info swapdonkey, there is a lot of good information on that site, I have never seen it before. Backcountry, trying out different bullet, powder, cartridge combinations is why most of us are here. Its what I enjoy doing. I don't load ammo purely for velocity, as most of us know velocity doesn't kill animals.

[Snowwolfe]

Be interesting to see how this works out for you. What is the rate of twist for your rifle?

[mainer_in_ak]

If it were a 35 whelen with a little more bore, or a 9.3x62, you'd probably see more velocity, BUT I don't think a 275 grainer is entirely out of the question. If I can get 2,460 fps out a 300 grain swift a frame (9.3x62) using Alliant MR 2000 powder, you should at least be able to get 2,350 fps if you use this powder. Stay with standard large rifle primers, the powder is ignited just fine with them. I'd almost be willing to place a bet with you, that you'd see 2,350 fps or more from a 20" barrel. Count on more velocity is you're barrel is longer than 20"

[Paul H]

sounds like a waste of time and bullets/powder to me ..... 250's are too heavy for that MV potential

Bingo!

I'm sure you could get them going 2100-2200 fps, but I don't see any terminal benefit over a 250 gr @ 2400, or say a 225 tsx @ 2600 fps. I would take a swag (use at your risk, this is just guess) that your top 275 gr load will be ~2-3 grs less powder than your top 250 gr load with say RL15.

Even at the elevated velocity of the 338 win mag the 275 speers didn't offer anything over what a "premium" 250 gr going 200 fps faster would do, and a cup core bullet just isn't tough enough to launch them out of a 338 ultra mag or 338-378.

[The Kid]

275 and 300 grain bullets are what the 333 OKH made it's reputation on. I know that Elmer wasn't seeing the velocities he was claiming but even so there can be no denying that he killed a ton of stuff with it. I'd bet with the AI version you could see 2300 out of at least a 22" tube and that's nothing to sneeze at. While that speed won't give you a super flat trajectory, it will be easy on cup and core bullets and usable out to 250 or 300 yds.

[bigswede358]

If I get some free time this weekend I hope to get back in the reloading room and see what I can come up with. I will have to look and see what powders I have on hand that will work with this, I'm thinking maybe H4831 or RL15. I'm expecting to get between 2200 and 2300 fps out of this combination. If they shoot good I might have to leave my 350 rem mag at home during elk season and pack the 338-06ai into the thick stuff.

[bigswede358]

Be interesting to see how this works out for you. What is the rate of twist for your rifle?

I am pretty sure it is 1 in 10.

[drow]

I think 4831 is too slow for much velocity. You should be able to get 2350-2400 with RL-15 and a 22-24" barrel.

[Paul H]

Based on my experience with a 24" 35 whelen AI I'd expect that pushing a 275 gr bullet 2350-2400 fps out of a 338-06 ai is going to be right on the threshold of loosening up primer pockets which with modern brass typically occurs in the 72-73,000 psi range. Yes, Ackley's can approach belted mag velocities, but only at high pressures. If you want 338 win mag performance, re-chamber, don't redline your pressures in an Ackley.

I believe you'll find that a prudent velocity to work up to in the 338-06 ai with a 275 is the 2200 fps range.

[Murphy]

I have loaded 4350 powder with these old Speer 275's. I am guessing it was IMR but not sure. I think I remember 52.0 grains or there about and velocity of about 2200 fps. It was a decade or so past. I am sure 4350 would be the powder for this one with that bullet, standard primers, adjust load up and down and chronograph each charge weight. It is too much bullet for that case but it will work and will penetrate like a freight train but won't expand much at all.

[bigswede358]

Thanks for all the good information. Murphy it is good to hear from somebody that has loaded this bullet/cartridge combination. I do have some 4350, I might have to load some up just for the heck of it.

[Snowwolfe]

Might give RL 17 as well as Ramshot Hunter a try if you have any laying around. 2250-2300 fps with that 275 grain bullet would be a nice moose or brown bear killer. Ballistics would be very similar to the 9.3x74R which has a proven track record and it tosses out 286 grain slugs at the 2250-2300 levels. If the bullets stabilize bet you will get fantastic penetration.

[Murphy]

Might give RL 17 as well as Ramshot Hunter a try if you have any laying around. 2250-2300 fps with that 275 grain bullet would be a nice moose or brown bear killer. Ballistics would be very similar to the 9.3x74R which has a proven track record and it tosses out 286 grain slugs at the 2250-2300 levels. If the bullets stabilize bet you will get fantastic penetration.

Good info on the powder. That RL-17 is worth a try I'm not too familiar with Ramshot but about the right rate. The Speer 338/275 is a semi spitzer and thus shorter, about the length of a 250 grain spitzer so it should work at even 2200 fps.

[drow]

Paul H, I have a 24" 35 Whelen AI as well, and have chronographed loads with the 275 gr Hawk at 2435 fps using Alliant's 2000-MR powder. These loads give only .0018" case head expansion, and have been reloaded 10 times with still snug primer pockets. I'd be very surprised if they were over 60,000 psi.

Being a little smaller diameter, the .338 bullet should not give quite the same velocity as the same weight in a .358 bullet. That is why I projected 2350-2400 fps for the 275 grainer. 2000-MR, H414 or the 4350s should give top velocities with these heavy bullets.

[mainer_in_ak]

Drow,

It's fine. You and I can be witnesses to top velocities using this powder, all with without excessive pressure. A couple forum members insinuated that my 300 grain Swift/9.3x62 load would somehow be unsafe with excessive pressure, but it simply wasn't the case. I'm on my third loading of my 9.3 Lapua cases. With bigswede having similar case capacity with his 338-06 AI, he'll certainly see the velocity he's expecting if he uses this mr-2000 powder.

[drow]

Mainer, have you ever pondered the beautiful symmetry of these 3 great medium bore calibers: 35, 9.3 and 375?

Starting with an even .350 bore diameter and .358 groove diameter of the Whelen, you move to the 9.3 and the bore diameter is the same as the Whelen groove, .358, while the groove diameter is .366. This .366 is the bore diameter of the .375, which is groove diameter in the great H&H and the newer 375 Ruger.

I personally think the 9.3 is the best balanced in an '06 size case (the 9.3x62 is a few grains larger than a Whelen AI), but I happen to like the ability to shoot .357 pistol bullets, so got a Whelen AI for myself. The 375 Hawk is another fine medium bore.

[mainer_in_ak]

No, I can't ponder it, ur making my head hurt with this cat inside of a hat inside of another hat, inside of anothernother hat, style of speak!