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Thread: Non Res and guides

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    Default Non Res and guides

    I know the guide requirement has been discussed recently on this site however what I am wanting to know as a NR and not following AK politics is, has any legislation ever been introduced to eliminate the guide requirement for any of the species that currently requires a NR to use a guide? Thanks and good hunting, TH

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    im not sure if it has, but it probably has at one point or another.....ill wait for someone with more knowledge to clarify....but from my personal opinion.....the guide requirement is an important thing....one reason being that it of course brings some employment, and helps protect inexperienced hunters from wildlife and wildlife from inexperienced hunters...such as getting themselves killed and making foolish decisions- such as taking a sublegal ram....very easy to do , and they are hard to judge anyway, as well as the terrain is extremely dangerous, as is the weather.....grizzly/ brown bear- dangerous animal, tough to judge age, size, and sex unless accompanied by cubs, if a hunter takes a bear and isnt satisfied then they may go out and kill another leaving the smaller one to rot on the field, a guide present helps eliminate those issues as well as to enforce rules and regs and even hunt boundaries.......so...just a few reason off the top of my head why that reg is in effect....besides obviously protecting those species from possible poachers....



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    Quote Originally Posted by tex hunter View Post
    as a NR and not following AK (hunting) politics
    Guides run things. They sit on the BOG. They get appointed to commissionerships. The state takes quite a bit because the guides are cash cows, but they're still getting fat enough on a guide requirement that they don't notice the state taking its "share." Find some non-resident friends and mail checks to State of Alaska (amounting to several million dollars, mind you) and you'll be able to get a word in edge-wise when a political conversation starts up here.

    Further, if you happen to take up an opinion different from said group of guides, you'll find yourself ostracized and grouped with "antis" as our pal Mark has found. Even when it comes to shooting wolves out of helicopters, there's blood on the collective hands of the guiding industry. Residents can wait for the next cycle of less wolves and more moose but guides need more moose every year - thus there can't be a year with lots of wolves.

    Further, don't even get someone started on king salmon guides....
    Last edited by SkinnyD; 02-15-2012 at 16:48. Reason: just wasn't done yet
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    I understand the points that you brought up and a lot of these animals that I am talking about someone such as myself has no experience with. However the cost of these hunts eliminates about 90% of the NR hunters. If this is the intent then mission accomplished. I realize some of these hunts require a lot of logistics as well as specialized gear and even livestock. But a goat hunt that you can do during the day and stay in town at night that costs $6000.00?? I live in Texas and can find $4000.00 deer hunts within three hours of my house all day long and I think that is ridiculous, however at least these hunts are on private land that had to be purchased and maintained as well as property taxes being paid every year. These AK hunts are on public land. I just think it's unfortunate that so many true hunters that desire to experience a sheep or goat hunt in Alaska will never be able to. Thanks and good hunting TH

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    Quote Originally Posted by SkinnyD View Post
    Guides run things. They sit on the BOG. They get appointed to commissionerships. The state takes quite a bit because the guides are cash cows, but they're still getting fat enough on a guide requirement that they don't notice the state taking its "share." Find some non-resident friends and mail checks to State of Alaska (amounting to several million dollars, mind you) and you'll be able to get a word in edge-wise when a political conversation starts up here.

    Further, if you happen to take up an opinion different from said group of guides, you'll find yourself ostracized and grouped with "antis" as our pal Mark has found. Even when it comes to shooting wolves out of helicopters, there's blood on the collective hands of the guiding industry. Residents can wait for the next cycle of less wolves and more moose but guides need more moose every year - thus there can't be a year with lots of wolves.

    Further, don't even get someone started on king salmon guides....

    oh yea, i didnt even think about the political side of things......thanks SkinnyD



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    public land huh? go back to your regs and BLM references and see where its public land....some places are but many arent....



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    I understand the points that you brought up and a lot of these animals that I am talking about someone such as myself has no experience with. However the cost of these hunts eliminates about 90% of the NR hunters. If this is the intent then mission accomplished. I realize some of these hunts require a lot of logistics as well as specialized gear and even livestock. But a goat hunt that you can do during the day and stay in town at night that costs $6000.00?? I live in Texas and can find $4000.00 deer hunts within three hours of my house all day long and I think that is ridiculous, however at least these hunts are on private land that had to be purchased and maintained as well as property taxes being paid every year. These AK hunts are on public land. I just think it's unfortunate that so many true hunters that desire to experience a sheep or goat hunt in Alaska will never be able to. Thanks and good hunting TH

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    Quote Originally Posted by tex hunter View Post
    However the cost of these hunts eliminates about 90% of the NR hunters. If this is the intent then mission accomplished.
    Ding Ding Ding

    They have a choice between guiding requirement and all draw permits all the time. One guarantees tons of money and one does not. Easy choice for a man in a suit.

    And the shame of it is that Alaska would be a perfect place to actually let biologists do their job in wildlife management. I can imagine that they lead incredibly frustrated lives...
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    Quote Originally Posted by tex hunter View Post
    I understand the points that you brought up and a lot of these animals that I am talking about someone such as myself has no experience with. However the cost of these hunts eliminates about 90% of the NR hunters. If this is the intent then mission accomplished. I realize some of these hunts require a lot of logistics as well as specialized gear and even livestock. But a goat hunt that you can do during the day and stay in town at night that costs $6000.00?? I live in Texas and can find $4000.00 deer hunts within three hours of my house all day long and I think that is ridiculous, however at least these hunts are on private land that had to be purchased and maintained as well as property taxes being paid every year. These AK hunts are on public land. I just think it's unfortunate that so many true hunters that desire to experience a sheep or goat hunt in Alaska will never be able to. Thanks and good hunting TH


    but you already said that....no need to repeat yourself here.....



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    I really dislike this law. It is only there for the guides benefit to make money. The reason stated is for the safety of the hunters but that is not really the case. For example, a person has lived in Alaska for twenty years and successfully hunted brown bear, goats, and sheep, etc. They then move out of Alaska and become non-residents. They now must hire a guide to hunt legally in Alaska for certain species that they have been successful for previously. Now, a person who has never hunted or done much outdoors has just moved to Alaska and waited one year to be a legal resident. They are now legal to hunt anything in Alaska. Which one is likely to be safer?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefty View Post
    I really dislike this law. It is only there for the guides benefit to make money. The reason stated is for the safety of the hunters but that is not really the case. For example, a person has lived in Alaska for twenty years and successfully hunted brown bear, goats, and sheep, etc. They then move out of Alaska and become non-residents. They now must hire a guide to hunt legally in Alaska for certain species that they have been successful for previously. Now, a person who has never hunted or done much outdoors has just moved to Alaska and waited one year to be a legal resident. They are now legal to hunt anything in Alaska. Which one is likely to be safer?
    why, the one with the bigger better rifle of course!

    heres an idea, dont leave Alaska..........



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    What I don't understand is why there is a guide requirement for griz in Unit 20. Currently a NR hunter can hunt moose DIY but can't shoot a griz on the same hunt. The griz population in 20 has exploded. They did away with the resident $25.00 tag a couple years ago. Same with Unit 25. Lots of Griz that eat lots of moose calves. Let the NR's kill em without a guide. Maybe someone else here can give a good, sensible reason why a NR DIY moose hunter should not be able to kill a griz on the same hunt. I can't think of one. If he can be "trusted" by the state to determine a legal Bull and can shoot 3 blackies DYI, why does he have to watch the griz walk? Keep in mind, these are two areas where there is no resident tag required. The state wants us to kill the griz.
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    I have mixed feelings about this as I have stated in other threads. Part of me feels bad for all the guys out there that can't hunt but I also don't believe that hunting sheep, goat and grizz are some sort of inalienable American right. I would love to commute in a BMW instead of my Matrix but I can't afford the luxury. I grew up wanting to hunt these animals so my plan was always to eventually make the move here and do it. It is a sacrifice in many ways to be here but here I am making childhood dreams into reality.

    The harsh truth is that game population cannot sustain to open the non res flood gates. Every single non res hunt would have to be a draw and without the prospect of having to pay out the nose for a guide I can bet that pulling a draw tag would become very difficult with all of the competition.

    The way I see it now is save some coin for 10-15 years and purchase your dream hunt. Or change the rules and put in for a sheep tag for eternity with the possibility of never drawing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snyd View Post
    . Maybe someone else here can give a good, sensible reason why a NR DIY moose hunter should not be able to kill a griz on the same hunt. I can't think of one. If he can be "trusted" by the state to determine a legal Bull and can shoot 3 blackies DYI, why does he have to watch the griz walk? Keep in mind, these are two areas where there is no resident tag required. The state wants us to kill the griz.
    I think its one of many laws that creates job opportunitys with the stroke of a pen, Guides, outfitters and transporters need to work, and theres good $$ in the industry of Hunters servents, and most likely keeps quite a few guys in this state off unemployment and foodstamps and has them paying tax's..... Thats gotta be good, at least for a few Alaskans to make $$
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkinnyD View Post
    Guides run things. They sit on the BOG. They get appointed to commissionerships. The state takes quite a bit because the guides are cash cows, but they're still getting fat enough on a guide requirement that they don't notice the state taking its "share." Find some non-resident friends and mail checks to State of Alaska (amounting to several million dollars, mind you) and you'll be able to get a word in edge-wise when a political conversation starts up here.

    Further, if you happen to take up an opinion different from said group of guides, you'll find yourself ostracized and grouped with "antis" as our pal Mark has found. Even when it comes to shooting wolves out of helicopters, there's blood on the collective hands of the guiding industry. Residents can wait for the next cycle of less wolves and more moose but guides need more moose every year - thus there can't be a year with lots of wolves.

    Further, don't even get someone started on king salmon guides....
    you do realize currently there is only one guide on the BOG, and he appears to be pretty resource minded, not to mention must excuse himself from conversation and excuse his vote when an issue that could impact him is brought forward.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt&FishAK View Post
    public land huh? go back to your regs and BLM references and see where its public land....some places are but many arent....
    State land is the only sure thing for public access any longer, many of the fed lands are looking to cut down on hunters access.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hayduke View Post
    I have mixed feelings about this as I have stated in other threads. Part of me feels bad for all the guys out there that can't hunt but I also don't believe that hunting sheep, goat and grizz are some sort of inalienable American right. I would love to commute in a BMW instead of my Matrix but I can't afford the luxury. I grew up wanting to hunt these animals so my plan was always to eventually make the move here and do it. It is a sacrifice in many ways to be here but here I am making childhood dreams into reality.

    The harsh truth is that game population cannot sustain to open the non res flood gates. Every single non res hunt would have to be a draw and without the prospect of having to pay out the nose for a guide I can bet that pulling a draw tag would become very difficult with all of the competition.

    The way I see it now is save some coin for 10-15 years and purchase your dream hunt. Or change the rules and put in for a sheep tag for eternity with the possibility of never drawing.
    I second this statement

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    Quote Originally Posted by SkinnyD View Post
    Ding Ding Ding

    They have a choice between guiding requirement and all draw permits all the time. One guarantees tons of money and one does not. Easy choice for a man in a suit.

    And the shame of it is that Alaska would be a perfect place to actually let biologists do their job in wildlife management. I can imagine that they lead incredibly frustrated lives...
    skinny??? who would you say is doing the job? if not the biologist? i sit in many meeting where bios give a complete report in great detail about the work they do. considerable wieght is often given to their opinions, and recomendations. unfortunatly... Many people would rather disregard that work, and call them liars. Science is often as not; NOT the science a person wants to hear.. Sorry about that folks...
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    Come on summer!!!!!







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    Oh well, so much for the annual non-resident rants. I thought something was going to be changed with all the convictions that were on display here. I know now next year, I'll ignore all the emotional diatribes. Ok, back to the reloading table.

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