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Thread: A big game guide speaks out against snaring and aerial shooting of grizzlies

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default A big game guide speaks out against snaring and aerial shooting of grizzlies


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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Damm good write up and I agree 100% because there is no 110% and believe in reality
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    Don't know about anyone proposing to snare Grizzlies or shooting them from the air. Same day airborn would not be the same as shooting them from the air.

    There is several proposals in to snare Black Bears. And their is ways to snare Black Bears without catching Grizzlies. The Canadians do it all the time, with a very successful rate. Also no by-catch of Grizzlies.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graybeard
    Don't know about anyone proposing to snare Grizzlies or shooting them from the air. Same day airborn would not be the same as shooting them from the air.

    There is several proposals in to snare Black Bears. And their is ways to snare Black Bears without catching Grizzlies. The Canadians do it all the time, with a very successful rate. Also no by-catch of Grizzlies.
    Roggie, hope you're doing well, maybe see you at the upcoming meeting.

    All this above is incorrect. It's all in the proposal book. The new unit 19 control plans from the Dept include the aerial shooting of both black and grizz from the air, and are up at the Region III meeting. The aerial shooting of grizzlies up north as part of the muskox protection efforts were approved. Prop 141 from the Dept to legalize the snaring of black bears will also consider legalizing snaring/keeping of grizzlies.

    They already legalized the snaring of grizzlies in Unit 16.

    Something I want to stress: It is impossible to catch only black bears in the bucket sets. It is a 100% sure thing some grizzlies will be caught.

    One last thing, nowhere in Canada or the lower 48 states is it legal to snare black bears where grizzly bears are also present. That's why it's allowed in some places, because there is no potential at all to catch any other type of bear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bushrat View Post

    They already legalized the snaring of grizzlies in Unit 16.
    This statement is incorrect as well only certain portion of unit 16b is open to brown bear snaring...

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    Yes, John, only a part of overall Unit 16 is open to grizzly snaring. But it doesn't make the statement incorrect unless you want to nitpick <grin>.

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    oh crap.. i think you and the wild alliance, and defender wolf lovers are the only ones with real (edited) about this subject.

    personally .. if they would allow bear snaring in 20A.. there s a WHOLE bunch of us local who would have lines out tomorrow. black and brown. BOTH i have to many now, and if i came home and found the ********* breaking into things tied to a tree.. it would be somuch nicer to just SKIN IT..

    dont care if its NOT sporting or Ethical.. I just want to thin the heck out of them. dead is DEAD.. is DEAD. no matter how you look at it... shootem from 100 yards or 1000 or 1 don't matter its DEAD. you know the Native call it "Catching an animal" for a reason.

    ever see that movie.. Rescuers down under?

    my favorite song is on it sang by, Georce C Scott...

    " HOME HOME ON THE RANGE! where the critters are tied up in chains, stick a knife in the side, rip off the hide, and tomorrow do it again"

    really Mark, Some of these area it really just dont matter.
    Last edited by Michael Strahan; 02-11-2012 at 12:11. Reason: Language
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    Quote Originally Posted by bushrat View Post
    Yes, John, only a part of overall Unit 16 is open to grizzly snaring. But it doesn't make the statement incorrect unless you want to nitpick <grin>.
    Lol ok how about south bank of the Beluga river to the North bank of the Mcarthur river... That is a very small portion of unit 16B if you ask me. Your statement makes it sound like snaring is legal for all of unit 16 to include 16A.Or

    or was it the north bank of the beluga river to the south bank of the Mcarthur river I can't remember regardless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    oh crap.. i think you and the wild alliance, and defender wolf lovers are the only ones with real (edited) about this subject.

    personally .. if they would allow bear snaring in 20A.. there s a WHOLE bunch of us local who would have lines out tomorrow. black and brown. BOTH i have to many now, and if i came home and found the ********* breaking into things tied to a tree.. it would be somuch nicer to just SKIN IT..

    dont care if its NOT sporting or Ethical..

    " HOME HOME ON THE RANGE! where the critters are tied up in chains, stick a knife in the side, rip off the hide, and tomorrow do it again"

    really Mark, Some of these area it really just dont matter.
    Don't care if it's ethical huh? It shows in your stance on most of these issues. After the tuff guy talk, I'm not sure what the rest of your post meant. What's the gibberish in the middle...."both I".....huh?
    Last edited by Michael Strahan; 02-11-2012 at 12:12.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlpineEarl View Post
    Don't care if it's ethical huh? It shows in your stance on most of these issues. After the tuff guy talk, I'm not sure what the rest of your post meant. What's the gibberish in the middle...."both I".....huh?
    legally dead is dead...

    there are a hole bunch of ethic policeman out there that don't want things done becuase they don't like how you do it...

    i dont care if you kill an animal legaly ,, in a fence, on a tree, on the water, in the air, out of a snare, out of a boat, off the wheeler, dont care if you save the horn or not..dont care if you hike in, ride in, fly in, boat in, or screw the pooch in... the problem with hunter ethics is everyone has their own... and if you dont do it like they do your wrong.. and its hunter groups that are the worst..

    Bow hunt, rifle hunt, spear hunt, hand gun.. bare hands WHO CARES.. animal is dead.. and its legal... Defenders of wild life pulled 35,000 signatures in 17 hours and over $75,000 in funds this week.. because they use all our groups against us...

    and you guys that spend all your time dragging folks down because you dont like how its done.. LOL... yeah.. you lot only EVER agree when you can use it to suit your agenda.. ..

    Mark don't think killing bears in a snare is ethical... I DONT CARE>.. dont care what you think either.. getting pretty tired of having to dance the anti dance to go hunting anymore.. I kind of see it as you lot stepping on my rights... along the same way.. Samson and the AC are trying to by limiting antlerless hunt...

    so WHAT if a person does not like to hunt that way... as long as its LEGAL... its MY choice to CHOOSE. keep playing with your food.. and call it sport.. i will be eating, so will my kids.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    oh crap.. i think you and the wild alliance, and defender wolf lovers are the only ones with real boners about this subject.
    I doubt that's true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    legally dead is dead...

    there are a hole bunch of ethic policeman out there that don't want things done becuase they don't like how you do it...

    i dont care if you kill an animal legaly ,, in a fence, on a tree, on the water, in the air, out of a snare, out of a boat, off the wheeler, dont care if you save the horn or not..dont care if you hike in, ride in, fly in, boat in, or screw the pooch in... the problem with hunter ethics is everyone has their own... and if you dont do it like they do your wrong.. and its hunter groups that are the worst..

    Bow hunt, rifle hunt, spear hunt, hand gun.. bare hands WHO CARES.. animal is dead.. and its legal... Defenders of wild life pulled 35,000 signatures in 17 hours and over $75,000 in funds this week.. because they use all our groups against us...

    and you guys that spend all your time dragging folks down because you dont like how its done.. LOL... yeah.. you lot only EVER agree when you can use it to suit your agenda.. ..

    Mark don't think killing bears in a snare is ethical... I DONT CARE>.. dont care what you think either.. getting pretty tired of having to dance the anti dance to go hunting anymore.. I kind of see it as you lot stepping on my rights... along the same way.. Samson and the AC are trying to by limiting antlerless hunt...

    so WHAT if a person does not like to hunt that way... as long as its LEGAL... its MY choice to CHOOSE. keep playing with your food.. and call it sport.. i will be eating, so will my kids.
    Bummer, can't give you anymore rep.

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    OK, so they will be shooting Grizzlies from planes, so what? If there is too many, they need to be thinned out. I worked on the Musk-ox project, capturing them on Nunivak Island. Spent a month in Mekoryuk, and running around the island on snow machines. Hate to see the Musk-ox being killed on the slope by Grizzlies. I also suspect Polar Bears are guilty as well. They are adaptiable and can learn to hunt Musk-ox. I've heard reports, but can not conferm Polar Bears are doing this.

    As for snaring Grizzlies, again so what? I don't see any difference snaring a Wolverine, Wolf, Black Bear, or Grizzly.

    I shoot Grizzlies at long range, many people say that is unethical, so what. I am an old man, and can no longer walk like I used to. I sit on a hill; and watch for my pray. I've shot Moose out to 810 yards, one shot. I've killed Grizzlies out to 620 yards, first shot was a complete pass through, getting both lungs. I'm now hitting a milk jug out at 1200 yards, that is my new range. Just waiting for this spring.

    By the way, this is the first time I've been back in a couple of years, I've been busy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince
    oh crap.. i think you and the wild alliance, and defender wolf lovers are the only ones with real boners about this subject.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince
    i dont care if you kill an animal legaly ,, in a fence, on a tree, on the water, in the air, out of a snare, out of a boat, off the wheeler, dont care if you save the horn or not..dont care if you hike in, ride in, fly in, boat in, or screw the pooch in... the problem with hunter ethics is everyone has their own... and if you dont do it like they do your wrong.. and its hunter groups that are the worst..
    Sheesh, Vince, you're going so far out on a limb I sure hope you don't fall off and hurt yourself. One thing is for sure though, you are hurting the overall hunting community with rhetoric like this.

    You don't care if hunters kill an animal legally? And yet you try to paint anyone here who may disagree with certain things as antis...wow man that limb is sure bending and you may want to crawl back toward the tree.

    We don't need rhetoric like this here on this forum. Snaring of bears, aerial shooting of bears...we can disagree but still avoid trying to label those other hunters/trappers who may disagree as antis. And certainly we don't need to go down the road to where we get to the point we say we don't care about what is legal.

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    For what it's worth, Mark, I think Vince meant "i dont care (as long as) you kill an animal legaly (sic)". In his defense, right above that quote he also stated "legally dead is dead". I am pretty sure he's not condoning illegal taking of game, but rather arguing that any legal means is fine and that ethics should be left out of it.

    I disagree with Vince on much, but I think your reading of his post isn't quite what he intended.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    legally dead is dead...

    there are a hole bunch of ethic policeman out there that don't want things done becuase they don't like how you do it...

    i dont care if you kill an animal legaly ,, in a fence, on a tree, on the water, in the air, out of a snare, out of a boat, off the wheeler, dont care if you save the horn or not..dont care if you hike in, ride in, fly in, boat in, or screw the pooch in... the problem with hunter ethics is everyone has their own... and if you dont do it like they do your wrong.. and its hunter groups that are the worst..

    Bow hunt, rifle hunt, spear hunt, hand gun.. bare hands WHO CARES.. animal is dead.. and its legal... Defenders of wild life pulled 35,000 signatures in 17 hours and over $75,000 in funds this week.. because they use all our groups against us...

    and you guys that spend all your time dragging folks down because you dont like how its done.. LOL... yeah.. you lot only EVER agree when you can use it to suit your agenda.. ..

    Mark don't think killing bears in a snare is ethical... I DONT CARE>.. dont care what you think either.. getting pretty tired of having to dance the anti dance to go hunting anymore.. I kind of see it as you lot stepping on my rights... along the same way.. Samson and the AC are trying to by limiting antlerless hunt...

    so WHAT if a person does not like to hunt that way... as long as its LEGAL... its MY choice to CHOOSE. keep playing with your food.. and call it sport.. i will be eating, so will my kids.

    Vince the problem I see with this type of throw the ethics in the trash type of thing is that in this country there is a big percentage of people that can be swayed to the hunting side or to the anti hunting side, at some point if we offend those people with this type of in your face dont give a crap what you think thinking we the hunters are going to lose and none of our kids will be eating wild game.whether I agree with you or not doesnt matter I would just to hate to see that happen..

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    Quote Originally Posted by bushrat View Post
    Yes, John, only a part of overall Unit 16 is open to grizzly snaring. But it doesn't make the statement incorrect unless you want to nitpick <grin>.

    It makes the statement incorrect when you misquote or misrepresent something by omission for purposes of your own agenda.

    The end dosen't justify the means. Your point of view should have merit within the facts or not. Otherwise you are nothing more than a a a journalist. They are NEVER without a point of view they just cloak it in "journalism".

    I'd rather appreciate your pov in it's raw pure form than cloaked some way we have to wonder whether you really know what you are talking about or you have just been mislead or you misunderstood. It matters.

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    Default non-hunters and apples

    Quote Originally Posted by Bear View Post
    the problem I see with this type of throw the ethics in the trash type of thing is that in this country there is a big percentage of people that can be swayed to the hunting side or to the anti hunting side, at some point if we offend those people with this type of in your face dont give a crap what you think thinking we the hunters are going to lose and none of our kids will be eating wild game.whether I agree with you or not doesnt matter I would just to hate to see that happen..
    So very true Bear, +1. But you did leave out one very important fact: The huge majority (3 to 1? 4 to 1?) of the people that might be swayed one way or another - these same people that vote on whether or not we are able to continue to do what we do - are non-hunters. That makes it even more important that we portray ourselves both accurately and with honor (which I do believe we have, for the very most part).

    Of course there are bad apples in every barrel. That makes it even more important that the rest of us work especially hard to not be seen as a bad apple too.

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    Default Apology to Vince for misreading, my bad.

    Thank you to Brian for correcting me, I did not read correctly Vince's comment that he didn't care if anyone took an animal legally.



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    Quote Originally Posted by FamilyMan View Post
    So very true Bear, +1. But you did leave out one very important fact: The huge majority (3 to 1? 4 to 1?) of the people that might be swayed one way or another - these same people that vote on whether or not we are able to continue to do what we do - are non-hunters. That makes it even more important that we portray ourselves both accurately and with honor (which I do believe we have, for the very most part).

    Of course there are bad apples in every barrel. That makes it even more important that the rest of us work especially hard to not be seen as a bad apple too.
    FamilyMan thanks for that, I agree and also like to believe in portraying ourselves with honor!
    dave

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