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Thread: Comments Due 11/18/2011, Lake louise whitefish/lake trout netting included

  1. #1
    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Default Comments Due 11/18/2011, Lake louise whitefish/lake trout netting included

    Comments are due tomorrow, 11/18/2011, for the proposed changes in PWS and Upper Copper/Upper Su finfish, as well as sundry crab, shrimp, shellfish, and cod around the state.

    A big hot button topic for the folks around Glenallen and Paxson is the netting of whitefish and incidental lake trout. Everyone with a gun in the fight needs to get their comments in! Especially now that the Department has come out in opposition of any Board generated regulations restricting the fisheries. The Department issued its own proposal, 129, to change sport fish limits because of concerns of unsustainable harvest within the sport fishery. Yet it opposes changes to subsistence regulations citing harvest ticket reports of only a few lake trout harvested incidentally.

    On this forum last year was posted a photo of carcasses of dozens of lake trout, possibly more. Presumably from just one set. Permit holders reported a TOTAL harvest of 30 lake trout in Lake Louise, Susitna, and Tyone Lake drainages. The Department of Fish and Game is presenting to the Board this information, and a statement that harvest of Lake Trout in this fishery is minimal. ADF&G is also asking to limit sport fish harvest of larger fish, because the current average yearly take between Louise, Susitna and Tyone is estimated to be about 900 trout- this combined between subsistence, sport, and hook/release mortality of 10%. If the eye witness reports on the "subsistence" fishermen are correct, then they may be catching close to that number just as bycatch to whitefish.

    This is a big problem. Fish and Game is concerned about an average harvest of 900 fish, caught mainly by sport fishermen. They state that this is above sustainable levels. Yet they say that current harvest by whitefish netters IS sustainable, as they believe it is only 30 fish. I believe they are wrong. I believe the harvest by subsistence (in name only) users is much higher than reported to fish and game. So if 900 fish is unsustainable, what about 1200 fish? How about 2,000 fish? What will happen to sport fishing in the next 10 years if the netting continues to go unchecked in regulation, as recommended by ADF&G?

    (My numbers cited are taken from comments on proposals 57, 129 and 130, and can be found online in meeting information on the department website.) The Department has made its statement to the Board. Concerned anglers need to make theirs. The Board places a lot of weight upon Department positions: but faced with other evidence they can make a decision that opposes the department, or goes along with it- they can only get that other evidence from those who've seen it with their own eyes.

    So step up and get the word out! You have till 5pm the 18th to send your comments in, and have them as part of the meeting record.

  2. #2
    Member Laker Taker's Avatar
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  3. #3
    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Thanks for the pics, laker taker. Do you have a count of the heads? Also, if anyone else has pictures, including those that were posted last year, please post! And let the board of fish know.

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    The count that I had was just over a hundred....

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    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Huh. Well, you obviously can't count, cause only 30 lakers get taken a year in subsistence nets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by willphish4food View Post
    Huh. Well, you obviously can't count, cause only 30 lakers get taken a year in subsistence nets.
    I beg to differ....

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    Member Dirtofak's Avatar
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    Default

    30 is too many.

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    Member MRFISH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by willphish4food View Post
    If the eye witness reports on the "subsistence" fishermen are correct
    Ugh.

    I don't know the background on this one, willphish. What are you alluding to by putting the quotes around "subsistence".

  9. #9

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    It's Russians doing the "subsistence"...IF that matters to you!

    F&G knows this and knows the full scale of it happening. It has been pretty common knowledge for all. But hey, it is taboo to boo and hiss "subsistence" if you want to get a state pension. And THAT is what this is really about.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    It's Russians doing the "subsistence"...IF that matters to you!

    F&G knows this and knows the full scale of it happening. It has been pretty common knowledge for all. But hey, it is taboo to boo and hiss "subsistence" if you want to get a state pension. And THAT is what this is really about.
    Subsistence is about the use, not the users. Da?

  11. #11

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    Yup,
    Exactly what F&G says. Da?

    What they do not acknowledge is that some "users" are more diligent, truthful, honest and caring...and some are not. Admittedly, the law paints them all with the same broad brush...hence why we are having this discussion in the first place.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Subsistence

    I haven't made a big deal about it but I may as well mention that the Fairbanks F&G advisory committee has seen fit to try and screw the sport fishermen by trying to reclassify personal use on the Copper to subsistence,(again ). This will be the 4th visit to the BOF of this ludicrous proposal. The socialist agenda they have going on up in Fairbanks is akin to our current leaders in Washington DC. Yet another attack on free enterprise in the private sector. Anyway just a heads up, you think the Russians are abusing Lake Louise, wait till they have priority w/ their dipnets over the sports fishermen in the upper Copper and its tributaries. I urge you to attend the BOF meeting and voice your concern.





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  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    I haven't made a big deal about it but I may as well mention that the Fairbanks F&G advisory committee has seen fit to try and screw the sport fishermen by trying to reclassify personal use on the Copper to subsistence,(again ). This will be the 4th visit to the BOF of this ludicrous proposal. The socialist agenda they have going on up in Fairbanks is akin to our current leaders in Washington DC. Yet another attack on free enterprise in the private sector. Anyway just a heads up, you think the Russians are abusing Lake Louise, wait till they have priority w/ their dipnets over the sports fishermen in the upper Copper and its tributaries. I urge you to attend the BOF meeting and voice your concern.
    Now Please, just how is classifying dipnetting as subsistance on the copper going to shaft the sports fishermen. It will help if anything. Commercial fisherman don't want to see it because it means allowing more fish up river instead of in their nets. Nothing says the reclassification means people will be able to take as much as they want. There will still be limits. However the limit on kings should be returned to what it use to be. The commercial guys don't want this because it means they'll have to allow more to pass the nets. Folks in Cordova are allowed to subsistance fish at the mouth, users above the bridge can also. But Alaskans, who have dipped in the Canyon for decades, where natives originally dipped as well, are treated as personal use fisherman with no management priority. More fish in the river will mean more fish for everybody, except maybe for those commercial nets at the mouth.

    I really don't see how this is a socialist agenda, in fact it's hard working Alaskan trying to feed there families. If anything, I'd say they're fighting the tyranny that the commercial fishing industry holds over the state's resource. It's about time people stood up to Longshank and his Nobels.

  14. #14
    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Default Halibutgrove joins the Occupy movement

    Quote Originally Posted by Halibutgrove View Post
    Now Please, just how is classifying dipnetting as subsistance on the copper going to shaft the sports fishermen.
    Subsistence has priority over sport. Plain and simple, subsistence doesn't have to share the burden of conservation in years of shortage

    Quote Originally Posted by Halibutgrove View Post
    really don't see how this is a socialist agenda, in fact it's hard working Alaskan trying to feed there families.
    Don't you think you've worn out the "hard working Alaskan" line by now? The Russians that net lake trout are hard working Alaskans. Gimme a break, all this is about is hurting private enterprise, In the 48 years I've been alive in this state, personal use has worked just fine on the Copper, just look at the success stories in the dipnet thread. I can tell by your tone you'll stop at nothing to do away w/ the mom and pop guide and tackle businesses as well as the thriving commercial fishery. How many more industries lost due to socialists can this state bear? You are a socialist through and through, you want your free handout, be danged w/ free enterprise. You need to hop in your motorhome and go help shelter your brethren in the occupy wall street movement, they'll be down w/ your cause, they hate it when Americans make money. Your true colors are pathetic





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