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Thread: Will this renew interest in Alaska CCW Permits?

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    Member JOAT's Avatar
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    Default Will this renew interest in Alaska CCW Permits?

    Now that the House has passed the National Carry Permit bill, we are that much closer to a national CCW reciprocity law that reasserts the 2nd Amendment right to carry for self-defense on a national level. It basically means that when a state issues a CCW permit to an individual, the other states must honor it, just as they do with driver's licenses.

    Since Alaska doesn't require a CCW permit, but has the provisions to issue them, I suspect this could renew the interest in obtaining the permits rather than just going with the "shall carry" statute, which is not valid in other states as there is no permit associated with it.
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    Lots of states will be interested in challenging this from the county level to the Supreme Court System. It'll be a lawyers bread and butter for years.
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

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    Member JOAT's Avatar
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    Oh yeah they will. I suspect that CA, NY and NJ will be the first to file. They are already claiming that their highly restrictive permit systems would be compromised by the suposedly "weak" permits issued by other states. This brings the question right back around to the 2nd Amendment in some regards, but "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" wording doesn't counter what this law is doing. It is affirming that the individual states are not to "infringe" on the right to carry of people from other states. It adds no new restrictions. Thus, it's not countering the 2nd Amendment at all. And it doesn't change the way a particular state may run the CCW permitting system for their own residents. It says that when a non-resident passes through one state with a valid carry permit from his own state, that the state he is visiting can't throw him in jail. And this has happened on numerous occasions.
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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    As written Alaskans will not need a permit to carry anywhere.The law states if you can CCW in your state its good for all.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    This will become the biggest mess to hit CCW. Bottom line is that it may pass, but there will be so many ammendments and restrictions that obtaining a CCW permit will be a major hurdle. CCW courses will become a 3 day affair with a major shooting qualification and in-depth legal side - covering the basics of all states laws.
    This will not be a 'Got an AK permit then carry anywhere' bill, it will become a 'Get a new Nationally recognised AK CCW permit if you want to carry out of state'.
    I am not saying that is any bad thing, but I doubt their will be a lot of grandfathering of permits - most likely that when your permit expires you will have to take the new 'nationally recognized' course.
    Pretty stupid really that the govt is wasting time and money debating something that is a constitional right and has no need for a permit. In every state that has a 'shall carry' law then if you can buy a handgun then you will get a permit, so what is the point of a national ccw permit??? If you can legally buy a handgun, you will get a permit.

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    I don't believe that the other states will question the validaty of the 2nd Amendment that would be a fools errand. The suite brought forth would probably be concerning states rights to self goverment. I haven;t read the bill but believe it adresses the the rights of persons who have a CHL rather than the right of concealed carry in their state. Most states that have CHL also have a addendum that makes concealed carry without a permit a violation of that states laws. BUT, before it's over you'll need a CHL to buy a handgun in the US.
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

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    Member JOAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    As written Alaskans will not need a permit to carry anywhere.The law states if you can CCW in your state its good for all.
    Not true. The bill (if approved and signed into law as is) says that a Conceal Carry PERMIT issued in one state will be valid when traveling through another state. It does not consider non-permit "shall carry" laws as a permit. Thus, the handful of "shall carry" states will need to issue a permit to people. Whether they make you take a class to go along with it or you just fill out an application online and they mail you a permit is totally up to the individual states.

    I don't see this as a mess at all. It actually clears the current interstate travel "mess" up. People are being criminalized when they cross a border with a firearm. One of the tasks of the federal goverment is to step in when interstate issues arrise. This is an interstate issue and really doesn't have anything to do with what a state does to it's own residents. What this law does is prevent authorities in places like NJ from arresting a guy at the airport who is traveling with a firearm in his baggage that was legal in his home state, legal for the airline, and legal for his destination state. But he gets arrested because his plane was diverted to an anti-gun state where he was stuck with his gun for hours at no fault of his own. That's what this bill is intended to stop. The traveling citizen must still abide by the methods and means carry laws in the state he is visiting. This only allows him to carry under his home state's permit, but by the laws of the state he is visiting. As a non-resident, he can't get a permit in the state he is visiting and therefore cannot carry at all. Hence the state he is visiting is infringing on his Federal right to carry. Hence the need for the Federal law making legally issued CCW permits valid across state lines.

    To me, it's as common sense as being able to cross the border with your home state's drivers license. How many states don't let a visitor drive unless they get a new drivers license from them?

    If you see that much of a difference between operating a motor vehicle and possessing a firearm, then that is telling of the root of the anti-gun and gun-o-phobia problems that we have. A gun is just a tool. We need to stop spreading such fear of hand tools.
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    Member High Country's Avatar
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    First off let me say that I am a major supporter of the 2nd amendment and the right to carry. However does anyone think that our forefathers had any insight into how watered down common sense would become in this country? I donít think they had a clue! A little training doesn't hurt anyone as long as the cost stays within reason. As Alaskans, we are different. Most of us have grown up with guns and hunting. This is not the same everywhere else. Quite the opposite in most places throughout the US.

    I will use myself as an example. I have shot guns and hunted in Alaska my entire life. My father did a good job instilling gun safety into me. I spent four years in the USMC infantry (a ton of weapons training) and spent the last six months in the Corps as a Heavy Machinegun Instructor at Division Schools. So I feel as though I have a pretty fair background in weapons manipulation. I recently attended the Redback One Pistol course, I learned a lot and it served as a good review of things I had forgotten over the years.

    Then you have Average Joe in the US. Probably has seen plenty of gun fights on TV and has not had any kind of weapons training. He decides he is going to concealed carry and buys a nice new handgun. Does he know how to fire it accurately so as to not endanger innocent bystanders if the weapon is drawn? Does he even know how to draw it properly if needed under a cover garment? Does he understand target identification, weapon retention, the laws surrounding self defense, and the list goes on.

    One more example I will give before I get off the proverbial soapbox. When Alaska still required CCW permits a friend of mine and his wife attended the class. His wife is an intelligent woman who he some firearms background (mostly duck hunting). They successfully completed the course. A few days after the course she was home alone and heard a rustling at the door. She got nervous and went and grabbed a gun and pointed it at the door. Her husbandís brother (who lived there at the time) came through the door (after using the wrong key to get in) and almost got shot. Luckily he didnít. Some may argue that she did act appropriately and did not fire. I would disagree as I feel she became sacred after attending the class. She went to the bedroom to retrieve the gun, why didnít she just look out the window and see the brothers car in the driveway? There are plenty of other safe options that could have happened as well, but this post is getting long.

    The point of me telling this story is that even people who possess some semblance of intelligence can easily make mistakes with firearms. Proper training is the key, especially as it pertains to CCW. Now before I get jumped on let me state again that I completely support the second amendment and the right to bear arms. However if someone is going to conceal a weapon next to me or my family I would like to know that they have received some legitimate training where failure of the course is an option. Open carry is different in my mind. If I can see you have a weapon I can choose to stay near you or move away. Just my opinions.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    My biggest concern is it does away with the states rights issue. The five states that don't require a permit now are not required to change state law. Of course it will be a very cold day indeed for me to what to leave the state
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    I know that it would get me back to a CCW course sooner than later. I took the course years ago, but let the permit lapse . I have been considering getting back and retaking the course to get the permit again, but there isn't much rush since we don't need it up here. If it meant I could carry concealed anywhere else in the nation (as opposed to just where we have reciprocity currently) I wanted, I would be more encouraged to take the course sooner.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    I also support the 2nd amendment but I am confused on your stand on concealed carry High Country. Not trying to start a arguement but it seems that you favor open carry as opposed to concealed carry. I am totally not in favor of this. It would be ok out in the field but would not want to see it in our towns. When afield the law abiding people should have the right to carry any way they choose. Open carry to me would be like having a sign around your neck telling criminals to shoot me first. I hope I have misread or misunderstood your post.

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brav01 View Post
    I haven;t read the bill but believe it adresses the the rights of persons who have a CHL rather than the right of concealed carry in their state. Most states that have CHL also have a addendum that makes concealed carry without a permit a violation of that states laws. BUT, before it's over you'll need a CHL to buy a handgun in the US.
    What's a CHL?

    Tim

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    Quote Originally Posted by tccak71 View Post
    What's a CHL?

    Tim
    CHL probably means Concealed Handgun License??

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Thugs try to stay away from folks with guns like HOG members stay away from 1%ers bars
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Cast Iron,

    I believe you did misunderstand my post or I did not word it sufficiently. I am for concealed carry! But I strongly support training for people to do so. Should it be mandatory for everyone who wants to conceal carry? I think so, with some notable exceptions, i.e. LEO, armed forces infantry, etc. These types of folks have extensive background in weapons. Not saying they couldnít improve or learn something from a good course. I did.

    Perhaps I am pessimistic in saying that I donít trust the ability of most of our society to just throw a handgun in a holster and be able to effectively and safely employ it when necessary, under stress. What is wrong with constructing a REAL course that people have to pass to carry concealed? Once again I will point out that I feel Alaskans are different from most of the US, as guns are a regular part of most of our lives. However there is still a large difference in deploying a weapon from concealment and carrying a rifle for moose.

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    Member greythorn3's Avatar
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    what people dont know wont hurt them, out of sight out of mind. heck run around town with a buncha dynomite straped to your torso with a jacket on and no one would ever know.
    Semper Fi!

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    I support decent people with common sense carrying all the time! That said, I have had CCW's in 3 states and they all have different laws for what is warranted in using lethal force. For that reason alone i think it is a great idea to go to a class and learn the laws of where you plan on carrying. Also, it is important to remember that individual cities can have ordinances that forbid carrying within a state that allows it.

    I have got to go along with Greythorn about 'out of sight out of mind"- what they don't know won't hurt them until it needs to!

    Be safe!

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    Member greythorn3's Avatar
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    i am offended if people come onto my property with a ccw if they dont tell me before entering they have the ccw on them. i often do not want them around anymore of they ccw unannounced on me personal property.
    Semper Fi!

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKBEE View Post
    I support decent people with common sense carrying all the time! That said, I have had CCW's in 3 states and they all have different laws for what is warranted in using lethal force. For that reason alone i think it is a great idea to go to a class and learn the laws of where you plan on carrying. Also, it is important to remember that individual cities can have ordinances that forbid carrying within a state that allows it.

    I have got to go along with Greythorn about 'out of sight out of mind"- what they don't know won't hurt them until it needs to!

    Be safe!

    The law, as written, will still allow the same restrictions that specific local ordinances may impose, such as our restrictions for carrying in bars, etc... People coming in from other states will still have to follow the "rules" of the state/city/county/etc... that they are visiting.

    It definitely will be a cause for discussion in a lot of locations over a variety of aspects. It will be interesting to see how things shape up. I like the premise, but I think they still have some kinks that will need to be worked out.

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