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Thread: Obama Admin Proposed Rules to Push Shooters of Federal Land???

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    Default Obama Admin Proposed Rules to Push Shooters of Federal Land???

    Obama Pushing Shooters Off Public Lands

    By Paul Bedard

    http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/was...f-public-lands


    Gun owners who have historically been able to use public lands for target practice would be barred from potentially millions of acres under new rules drafted by the Interior Department, the first major move by the Obama administration to impose limits on firearms.
    Officials say the administration is concerned about the potential clash between gun owners and encroaching urban populations who like to use same land for hiking and dog walking.
    "It's not so much a safety issue. It's a social conflict issue," said Frank Jenks, a natural resource specialist with Interior's Bureau of Land Management, which oversees 245 million acres. He adds that urbanites "freak out" when they hear shooting on public lands. [Read about the subpoena issued as a result of Operation Fast and Furious.]
    If the draft policy is finally approved, some public access to Bureau lands to hunters would also be limited, potentially reducing areas deer, elk, and bear hunters can use in the West.
    Conservationists and hunting groups, however, are mounting a fight. One elite group of conservationists that advises Interior and Agriculture is already pushing BLM to junk the regulations, claiming that shooters are being held to a much higher safety standard than other users of public lands, such as ATV riders.
    "They are just trying to make it so difficult for recreational shooters," said Gary Kania, vice president of the Congressional Sportsmen's Foundation. His group is one of several, including the National Wildlife Foundation, Cabela's and Ducks Unlimited, on the Wildlife and Hunting Heritage Conservation Council fighting the new rules. During a two-day meeting ending this afternoon, they are drafting their own changes to the BLM rules.
    "What we probably are going to be looking forward to is a reversal," said Kania. Asked about how to handle people who freak out when they hear shots on public lands, Kania said, "I don't know how to quanitify 'freaking out,'" and noted that he's seen people panicing when fly fishing in float tubes but nobody wants to ban then from rivers.
    BLM actually invited the fight, seeking the council's comments. But officials suggested to Whispers that no changes are being planned to the draft regulations.
    Over five pages, the draft BLM regulations raise concerns about how shooting can cause a "public disturbance." They also raise worries about how shooting and shooters can hurt plants and litter public lands.
    This is the key paragraph foes say could lead to shooters being kicked off public lands:
    "When the authorized officer determines that a site or area on BLM-managed lands used on a regular basis for recreational shooting is creating public disturbance, or is creating risk to other persons on public lands; is contributing to the defacement, removal or destruction of natural features, native plants, cultural resources, historic structures or government and/or private property; is facilitating or creating a condition of littering, refuse accumulation and abandoned personal property is violating existing use restrictions, closure and restriction orders, or supplementary rules notices, and reasonable attempts to reduce or eliminate the violations by the BLM have been unsuccessful, the authorized officer will close the affected area to recreational shooting." [Check out new Debate Club about whether Congress needs to overhaul gun trafficking laws.]
    Squeezing out shooters, says the draft policy, is needed because, "As the West has become more populated, recreational shooters now often find themselves in conflict with other public lands users, and the BLM is frequently called on to mediate these conflicts."
    At yesterday's meeting at Interior, the council balked at the BLM draft regulations, adding that the Obama administration was not being fair to shooters on the issue of safety.
    In a draft retort to BLM, the council said other users of public land aren't required to be as safe as shooters. They note that shooters have a much lower injury rate than others, like ATV users. "The policy fails to recognize that recreational shooting has one of the lowest incidences of death and injury compared to virtually any other outdoor recreational activity. The policy is prejudicial and discriminatory to target shooters as compared to other recreationists," said the council's draft response, expected to be finalized today.
    What's more, the group charged that the BLM is acting in a contradictory fashion, encouraging the shooting sports while limiting shooting areas.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    I guess some places may need some restriction.Heck I wish it was enforced on the no shooting road signs.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    I guess some places may need some restriction.Heck I wish it was enforced on the no shooting road signs.
    Yea I agree they need to bust road sign shooters with the laws we have.

    However I don’t think we need more rules because “urbanites freak out when they hear shooting on public lands.” I freak out when there is only one register open at Wal-Mart and If I can deal with that when I go to town they can learn to deal with hearing guns when they come to the woods or just stay out of the woods!
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    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    I have a little place up here in AK on public land where I go to shoot. It was a nice spot to escape the crowds at the shooting ranges. Over the past two years, it's been littered with shot up computers, refrigerators, propane tanks, beer cans, broken beer bottles, and limitless amounts of 7.62x39 mm spent brass and 12 gauge spent shells.

    It's disgusting to see all the fragmented litter, and it will probably get closed down because of the people who have no regard for their actions. In the spring, I'm going to clean it up in hopes that others will realize that we will lose this nice spot to shoot. I will leave a sign staked into the ground that I picked up the mess so that the spot won't get taken from us, and to please pick up your trash after your shooting session so we will have the spot for years to come.

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    Member sayak's Avatar
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    That sure comes as no surprise. For the L48 this will have some serious implications, but then things have been going downhill in those states regarding gun usage since WWII. For Alaska it will be different, I believe, as the Federal government under its many land management hats will be faced with disenfranchised and disgruntled firearms users. I would be among those who show up with a gun to protest such a prohibition with organized civil disobedience. Ultimately, we are the land owners, not the Fed.

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    Member akiceman25's Avatar
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    Am I the only person that finds it odd that the only news to report this is US News and Fox News.......?

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    Member JOAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    It's disgusting to see all the fragmented litter, and it will probably get closed down because of the people who have no regard for their actions. In the spring, I'm going to clean it up in hopes that others will realize that we will lose this nice spot to shoot. I will leave a sign staked into the ground that I picked up the mess so that the spot won't get taken from us, and to please pick up your trash after your shooting session so we will have the spot for years to come.
    It won't work. Been tried many times in many other places. I've tried it myself. Your sign will be shot up, used as a target stand, used for fire wood, or just simply vanish. The trash will continue to arrive and the morons will come out, shoot up their garbage, and leave it behind as they drive away. They simply don't care. You can't make them care. They have to choose to care, but they won't.
    Winter is Coming...

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    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akiceman25 View Post
    Am I the only person that finds it odd that the only news to report this is US News and Fox News.......?
    Tsk, tsk! Soon you be accused of wearing an aluminum foil hat. Everybody knows how completely objective and fair the whole media community is.

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    Member Hunt&FishAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    I have a little place up here in AK on public land where I go to shoot. It was a nice spot to escape the crowds at the shooting ranges. Over the past two years, it's been littered with shot up computers, refrigerators, propane tanks, beer cans, broken beer bottles, and limitless amounts of 7.62x39 mm spent brass and 12 gauge spent shells.

    It's disgusting to see all the fragmented litter, and it will probably get closed down because of the people w
    ho have no regard for their actions. In the spring, I'm going to clean it up in hopes that others will realize that we will lose this nice spot to shoot. I will leave a sign staked into the ground that I picked up the mess so that the spot won't get taken from us, and to please pick up your trash after your shooting session so we will have the spot for years to come.
    Mainer when you go to clean up, let me kno....... Id like to help if I'm not workin



    Release Lake Trout

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    Member stevelyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akiceman25 View Post
    Am I the only person that finds it odd that the only news to report this is US News and Fox News.......?

    Nope. The lamestream media goosesteps with this administration. They'll try and keep it quiet to minimize opposition because it fits into their leftist agenda.
    Now what ?

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    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
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    Well that took less than a dozen posts.


    The same old crowd, driving their WAAAAAAAAAmbulance around looking for windmills and unicorns....
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

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    Member Hunt&FishAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaHippie View Post
    Well that took less than a dozen posts.


    The same old crowd, driving their WAAAAAAAAAmbulance around looking for windmills and unicorns....
    Windmills and unicorns, and beavers...... BIG FUZZY BEAVERS



    Release Lake Trout

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    Member Dirtofak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sayak View Post
    Tsk, tsk! Soon you be accused of wearing an aluminum foil hat. Everybody knows how completely objective and fair the whole media community is.
    You broke my sarcasm meter!

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt&FishAK View Post
    Mainer when you go to clean up, let me kno....... Id like to help if I'm not workin
    Same here Mike, let me know and I'll do my best to be there!
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    Member mainer_in_ak's Avatar
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    with the snow, it might be hard to find much of anything, but I'll keep yah guys in mind come this spring. I'm headed down to my shooting spot to chronograph some handloads this weekend and I'm gonna bring a pull sled in case I do see trash. I should be able to at least find the general shapes of large pieces of trash under the snow.

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Well now after 3 years of "wonderful" and "uplifting" change we were promised its sooo nice to see our gov't focussing on such "important" tasks... Good Grief....
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    Premium Member MarineHawk's Avatar
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    Mercifully, it looks like they're backing off: http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/was...arget-practice

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarineHawk View Post
    Mercifully, it looks like they're backing off: http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/was...arget-practice
    "However, the official said it is possible that areas previously used for target practice that are too close to houses or areas of urban growth could be put off limits. The new plan would be to provide shooters with a map or guide on where they can go for target practice nearby, said the official.

    "It's the difference of driving two minutes [to shoot] or 15 minutes," said the official."



    I'd call that doublespeak, don't worry about it we are only closing so little you won't even notice. If it’s too close to a house or is unsafe in any manner there are already a litany of laws addressing that so why would they need to close lands that are essentially already closed by other safety laws??? Sounds like wag the dog with doublespeak and close lands to both hunting and shooting thus winning Sierra Club type votes back.
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    Member sayak's Avatar
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    This is a well known strategy: test the waters by shocking the general populace by saying you are going to do something big. If there there is a great outcry, back off and begin taking things in smaller increments.

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