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Thread: 223 ammo for predators

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    Default 223 ammo for predators

    I've been reading lots of posts on the forum about ammo but really have not found the answer I'm looking for.

    I just got a Remington 700, 24" barrel stainless in 223. I'm wanting to use it on fox and lynx mostly, if a wolf walks out that would be great. Any recommendations on ammo? I do keep all my furs so the less damage the better but with that said I don't want to loose my animals because they run away. I have a 4-12 scope on it, I would like to be able to shoot out to 300 with it 400 on a calm day. I will zero it at 100.

    thanks!

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    Member Roland on the River's Avatar
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    HI TEACHERMAN, FIRST, i RECOMEND YOU VISIT A GUN SHOP. tRY TO GET THE FREE REMINGTON PRODUCT CATALOG. iN THE BACK ARE BALLISTIC TABLES.
    tHIS WILL TELL YOU THE DROP AT EACH YARDAGE. tO ME, i WOULD SIGHT IN ABOUT 2 INCHES HIGH. THEN YOU WILL STILL BE ON THE ANIMAL AT 300 WITH MAYBE7-8 IN DROP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Teacherman View Post
    I've been reading lots of posts on the forum about ammo but really have not found the answer I'm looking for.

    I just got a Remington 700, 24" barrel stainless in 223. I'm wanting to use it on fox and lynx mostly, if a wolf walks out that would be great. Any recommendations on ammo? I do keep all my furs so the less damage the better but with that said I don't want to loose my animals because they run away. I have a 4-12 scope on it, I would like to be able to shoot out to 300 with it 400 on a calm day. I will zero it at 100.

    thanks!

    Barrel specs?

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    Member highestview's Avatar
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    The Hornady TAP did actually did well on caribou this fall in my Thompson Center. Didn't leave big exit wound @ 250 yards.
    In my Thompson, I actually really like the Wolf 62 grain hollow point stuff. That round isn't meant to expand at all and I've shot out to 600 yards with it. PMC (domestic made cheap stuff) is the same, at least in my gun. The 62 grain carries just a little more energy out at long ranges.

    Any full metal jacket bullets arent going to expand at all and ruin fur. For any fur animal, including wolf, expanding bullets aren't going to make a big difference in killing power/speed. Lot of foxes fall to cast bullets from .22lr. Any .223 round will put enough energy into any little animal to get the job done quick. FML bullets will save the fur and save money.
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    Teacher, here is a site you cab search anything for predator hunting you can dream of! I find a lot of very useful information on it just as I do here. Hope it helps
    http://www.predatormastersforums.com/

    Charlie

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    Member .300wby's Avatar
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    I too would like to find the answer for one round doing all... 223. I have used it exclusively and extensively for predators for quite a few years. Great for wolves... up to 300 yds.+ Ok for yotes as long as out there well over 100 yds. Fox and lynx...tears em up. FMJ's do not help due to the speed. Larger bullet? Slow it down to the magic below 3,000 fps? Loose effectiveness and accuracy at longer range??? Wish I knew the answer, anxious to hear more input too.

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    Member .300wby's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=highestview;1030409]The Hornady TAP did actually did well on caribou this fall in my Thompson Center. Didn't leave big exit wound @ 250 yards.
    In my Thompson, I actually really like the Wolf 62 grain hollow point stuff. That round isn't meant to expand at all and I've shot out to 600 yards with it. PMC (domestic made cheap stuff) is the same, at least in my gun. The 62 grain carries just a little more energy out at long ranges.


    I'll bet that wolf 62gr would be best even for fox etc. What's the velocity?

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    I guess I haven't shot enough critters to see the effects on smaller bodies, but I shoot 55gr FMJs out of my .223 and am perfectly happy with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by .300wby View Post
    Fox and lynx...tears em up. FMJ's do not help due to the speed. Larger bullet? Slow it down to the magic below 3,000 fps? Loose effectiveness and accuracy at longer range??? Wish I knew the answer, anxious to hear more input too.
    For fox and lynx, 223 is just too much. Sure, out past 300 yds it might be slow enough, but like 300wby says, it tears up thin skinned critters. Besides, lynx are generally animals of the brush/forest. 400 yd shots at them will be rare.
    The 22 magnum is a good round for calling critters/preds in brush. Shots under 100 yds will kill and not ruin fur.
    That 24 in. barrel will extract maximum velocity out of any round you shoot thru it. It will do a fair amount of damage to most any critter smaller than a wolf.
    If your stuck on using that gun, try reloading heavier bullets at slower velocities. A FMJ bullet going under 2000 ft/sec. might not do too much damage on fox/lynx but still have enough oomph for that rare wolf shot.
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    Are you looking for commercial ammo or reloading components (bullet recommendations)?

    If you reload, the options are endless but you can really tailor a round for what you want.

    The few times I shot FMJs at foxes and racoons, I found that unless you hit the heart or head, they kept running, but eventually did pile up. A high speed specialty varmint bullet should only penetrate one chest wall and blow out the heart/lungs without causing skin damage on the off-side, but I don't have first hand experience. I think it would depend on the size of the animal.

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    Marten Trappers spot on, .223, even with FMJ's tears up thin skinned Fur. Hit bones an the holes it blows, its much much worse.

    .22Magnum, or do headshots with that .223, about the only decent way to go, or your just gonna kill 'em and ruin the fur.

    Personally, I use a .22LR, or with 7.62X54R FMJ's upside the head.

    Good luck.
    If you can't Kill it with a 30-06, you should Hide.

    "Dam it all", The Beaver told me.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by .300wby View Post
    I'll bet that wolf 62gr would be best even for fox etc. What's the velocity?
    On the box it says 3100, so out of my 28" Thompson barrel, I know it's got to be at least 3200.
    Born in Alaska: The boundary lines have fallen for me in pleasant places; surely I have a delightful inheritance. Psalm 16:6

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    great info guys! I do carry a 22 mag with me and use it on fox and lynx under 100 yds but out past that it drops out quick. I got the 223 mostly for fox between 200-400 yds. I see them quite often at those ranges when I'm out riding and don't really want to waist them with my 338RUM

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    I was looking at some Hornady loads at Sportsmans today, 75gr and 77gr. both around 2800 fps. But they are $20 for 20 bullets, not bad but the wolf ammo and some of the other bulk stuff is a lot cheapers.

    I did talk to a guy that said the 40-50 gr V max ammo doesn't exit and stops them cold.

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    Teacherman, have you considered reloading?

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    You can use Trail Boss powder and slow that .223 right on down to about .22 Hornet velocity. You'll get less fur damage up close but long range you'll be out of gas pretty quick. Speed it up for 300yd performance and you're tearing up fur again.

    Can I suggest a 12ga stoked with a healthy dose of T shot? Lethal out to about 60yds or so (full choke) without destroying hides unless you call one in to bayonet range. If you see a critter out there at 200 you can always transition to the rifle.

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    We have a rabies and mange problem with fox, skunk, coon and possum so I bury them all but I have noticed that thru the rib shots with a 17M2 under 75 yds kills pretty quick and I don't get an exit hole. The 22 mag always exits with a dime size hole and a 17 HMR does as well under 50 yds. With the 17M2 they seem to jump in the air when hit, run 20 or 30 yds and lay down and are dead when I get there with the shovel. I shot a coon a week or so ago at probably 40 yds with a head shot and it did not exit but coon was DRT. I have a CZ 452 in 17M2 that is a one hole gun at 50 yds with a 4-12x Simmons....CZ's are great guns.

    Just a thought for someone looking for an excuse to buy a new gun.

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    I shoot varmit grenades out of my ar-223, works great from fox to wolves. I wait for a broadside shot and put it behind the shoulder. No exit holes on wolves or coyotes. Fox some times. Do not shoot em in the head though. Hitting solid bone such as skull blows em up.

  19. #19
    crazedBOWhunter
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    Teachermfan

    I didn't spend too much time reading the previous responses, but I too was searching long and hard for a good round to throw down range at the winter critters. I've tried quite a few...remington, hornady, federal, winchester, i could go on but I'll get to my point. I started out throwing FMJ b/c I figured least amount of pelt damage. Welp, I was right but I also became familiar with a very dis-heartening feeling of watching wounded animals run away. I had a few fox get away from me that I KNOW I put a good shot on. Couldn't quite find the right load after that. I went to soft rounds, hollow points, and lots of pelt damage. Well here's the answer: Federal Premium Barnes Triple Shock 55gr. If you look at the bullet, you will see it's a hollow point, but the darn thing stayes together VERY well. I've got three coyotes and two fox this year with them and only one fox opened up real bad. BUT, I attribute that to shooting him through some brush. I think the bullet opened up prior to hitting her. All the other animals have entry holes the diameter of my pinky and exit wounds the size of my thumb. One coyote I had to put a head shot on and it punched right through the skull w/ absolutely NO additional pelt damage. After that, I was sold! I'd give that a go. They're pricy though... $23.50ish a box of 20, but well worth the cost in my book. Let me know what you think....

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    I'm going to start with these!

    thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by crazedBOWhunter View Post
    Teachermfan

    I didn't spend too much time reading the previous responses, but I too was searching long and hard for a good round to throw down range at the winter critters. I've tried quite a few...remington, hornady, federal, winchester, i could go on but I'll get to my point. I started out throwing FMJ b/c I figured least amount of pelt damage. Welp, I was right but I also became familiar with a very dis-heartening feeling of watching wounded animals run away. I had a few fox get away from me that I KNOW I put a good shot on. Couldn't quite find the right load after that. I went to soft rounds, hollow points, and lots of pelt damage. Well here's the answer: Federal Premium Barnes Triple Shock 55gr. If you look at the bullet, you will see it's a hollow point, but the darn thing stayes together VERY well. I've got three coyotes and two fox this year with them and only one fox opened up real bad. BUT, I attribute that to shooting him through some brush. I think the bullet opened up prior to hitting her. All the other animals have entry holes the diameter of my pinky and exit wounds the size of my thumb. One coyote I had to put a head shot on and it punched right through the skull w/ absolutely NO additional pelt damage. After that, I was sold! I'd give that a go. They're pricy though... $23.50ish a box of 20, but well worth the cost in my book. Let me know what you think....

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