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Thread: Harvest of feeder kings

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    Default Harvest of feeder kings

    I am seeing a ton of posts about the great king fishing in the salt. From Oregon to Kodiak the get hit. I know down south some are hatchery fish but what impact does it have on the demise of the king runs in AK? All those fish would wind up in a river some where. I have no idea what the impact is but a boat in the salt keeps a hog or catches 8 kings its ok. If you did that on a river you would be in trouble. To me it seems we pound them in the salt and wonder why we dont have any in the rivers. again i do not know what impact it has and am not pointing fingers. This is in reference to sportfish. How much of an impact is it having on the king runs?

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    You are correct. Every salmon caught and retained in the ocean is one less that will make it up the rivers to spawn or to contribute to the in-river fishery. But this has been going on for centuries. At first, the only fishery was the Tribal folks with their dip nets. Then the early commercial guys started fishing in front of the Tribal folks with fish wheels, trap nets, horse drawn sienes, and gill nets. Then it was the trollers who caught them in the near-shore fishery before they entered the rivers. Then it was the high seas netters and trollers who caught them before they got close to shore.

    Those anglers catching feeder Chinook out of Homer in K-Bay, (in their kayaks or whatever) are likely hitting the 15lb sub-adult Chinook that would have returned to the Kenai, Kasilof, Deep Creek, Anchor, Deshka, Susitna, as 50lb+ mature adults. Those anglers are no different than the commercial trollers off SE Alaska who hit the Chinook salmon all winter long off Sitka or Ketchikan. Those winter Chinook are destined for the Columbia River (my backyard) next year. So, ya I feel your pain.

    Now you know what the Tribal folks have been complaining about for decades........

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    Quote Originally Posted by kgpcr View Post
    I am seeing a ton of posts about the great king fishing in the salt. From Oregon to Kodiak the get hit. I know down south some are hatchery fish but what impact does it have on the demise of the king runs in AK? All those fish would wind up in a river some where. I have no idea what the impact is but a boat in the salt keeps a hog or catches 8 kings its ok. If you did that on a river you would be in trouble. To me it seems we pound them in the salt and wonder why we dont have any in the rivers. again i do not know what impact it has and am not pointing fingers. This is in reference to sportfish. How much of an impact is it having on the king runs?
    Not true, not all kings found in the salt would end up in a river some where. Whittier, Seward and Homer all have saltwater terminal fisheries for kings.

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    Most of the kings taken in the winter around homer are from Canada. The Kenai Kings seem to all be around Old Harbor The one thing that needs to be stopped is the fishing on the spawning grounds. I just love the pics of a big red king being held up with the eggs running out on the ground the read that the fish was C&R!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cohoangler View Post

    Those anglers catching feeder Chinook out of Homer in K-Bay, (in their kayaks or whatever) are likely hitting the 15lb sub-adult Chinook that would have returned to the Kenai, Kasilof, Deep Creek, Anchor, Deshka, Susitna, as 50lb+ mature adults.
    Tests have been done on the feeder kings caught out of Homer and almost without exception they are not fish destined for Cook Inlet streams. The fish destined for the Kenai, Kasilof, and the like are far from Cook Inlet until April and beyond. Rather, the fish being caught in Kachemak Bay's troll fishery are from Canada, Washington, and Oregon.

    I think homerdave has the actual study info, so hopefully he can chime in here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cohoangler View Post
    You are correct. Every salmon caught and retained in the ocean is one less that will make it up the rivers to spawn or to contribute to the in-river fishery. But this has been going on for centuries. At first, the only fishery was the Tribal folks with their dip nets. Then the early commercial guys started fishing in front of the Tribal folks with fish wheels, trap nets, horse drawn sienes, and gill nets. Then it was the trollers who caught them in the near-shore fishery before they entered the rivers. Then it was the high seas netters and trollers who caught them before they got close to shore.

    Those anglers catching feeder Chinook out of Homer in K-Bay, (in their kayaks or whatever) are likely hitting the 15lb sub-adult Chinook that would have returned to the Kenai, Kasilof, Deep Creek, Anchor, Deshka, Susitna, as 50lb+ mature adults. Those anglers are no different than the commercial trollers off SE Alaska who hit the Chinook salmon all winter long off Sitka or Ketchikan. Those winter Chinook are destined for the Columbia River (my backyard) next year. So, ya I feel your pain.

    Now you know what the Tribal folks have been complaining about for decades........
    hate to be so unambigous, but you are just flat-out wrong.
    i was head tech doing CWT recovery in the homer troll king fishery for about 8 years, and we NEVER got a tagged feeder king from alaska. all tagged fish were sampled for maturity, and at the time there were tagged hatchery kings being released from ship creek, the ninilchick, halibut cove, the fishing hole, seldovia, and i believe a couple streams in the valley. there were also wild salmon being tagged in deep creek and the kenai. we NEVER got one as an immature.
    the study is available, might even be on the forum here somewhere as this comes up often. call bob begich or tim mckinley at the soldotna office if you want more info.
    of course, no good reason to let a few facts mess up your conviction. carry on....
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    Another thing is I am pretty sure the natural mortality of those feeder kings is pretty high so not all of the caught feeder kings would have survived to make to their home river. I'm not sure of the % though, and will see what I can dig up.

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    Default shakers

    My concern is the amount of shakers that are getting returned belly up, missing an eye, or in some rough shape due to being impaled on 5/0 hooks. Shakers are the small kings you can't keep and I mean small- some you catch are 14 inches long. In the S.E. we seem to catch a ton of these- all summer when targeting adult fish. Do you catch a lot of shakers when fishing K-Bay and who has any idea if they are Cook Inlet fish.

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    What part of SE do you catch the shakers? I didn't catch 1 this summer, both charter fishing and hand trolling.

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    Quote Originally Posted by amp View Post
    My concern is the amount of shakers that are getting returned belly up, missing an eye, or in some rough shape due to being impaled on 5/0 hooks. Shakers are the small kings you can't keep and I mean small- some you catch are 14 inches long. In the S.E. we seem to catch a ton of these- all summer when targeting adult fish. Do you catch a lot of shakers when fishing K-Bay and who has any idea if they are Cook Inlet fish.
    There is no minimum size limit in our area. I have turned in heads from fish 16"-18".
    Personally, I kill every feeder king I land, I smoke the small ones whole.
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    Homerdave, Have you heard any results from the DNA testing on kings yet? I was told that the dragger fleet observers were taking sampels.

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    We got 9 kings yesterday. 2 over 29 so legal and the other 7 from 12-24 inches. We get lots of shakers typically.
    Mike
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    congrats on the kings! I might have to pull my boat up there for a weekend before the roads get icy.

    We don't get many shakers on my side. I know that the E side of Dall can get full of them.

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    Where do the kings feed up that wind in UCI rivers?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MGH55 View Post
    Homerdave, Have you heard any results from the DNA testing on kings yet? I was told that the dragger fleet observers were taking sampels.
    They've been taking DNA samples from the Bering Sea trawl fishery for the last few years. I don't think the reports have been published yet though. The editors are pretty backed up with other reports evidently.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kgpcr View Post
    Where do the kings feed up that wind in UCI rivers?
    Most of them go to Kodiak and the Bering Sea.

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    Default Mixed stock Ocean Harvest of Cook Inlet Kings




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    Quote Originally Posted by kgpcr View Post
    I have no idea what the impact is but a boat in the salt keeps a hog or catches 8 kings its ok. If you did that on a river you would be in trouble. How much of an impact is it having on the king runs?
    Not even close to the same animal. Ocean fishing for kings is fair chase. You need to hunt for them and learn where they're hanging, then you need to present them w/ what they're feeding on. In the river they're not feeding, they're congregated all facing the same direction and there to spawn. People unintentionally floss them or they bite out of instinct or to protect their nest. IMO ALL river fishing for kings should be outlawed. I applaud harvesting as many kings as you can in the salt because its fair chase. Who cares if its bound for Cooks inlet.





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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    ...IMO ALL river fishing for kings should be outlawed...
    Thats two of us... you want to conserve a resource, protect it where is spawns.... +1 to you! (soon as the system lets me...)
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    Quote Originally Posted by homerdave View Post
    Thats two of us... you want to conserve a resource, protect it where is spawns.... +1 to you! (soon as the system lets me...)
    If I had my druthers you could skip the rep and start getting my fighting chair ready for me come derby day





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