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Thread: Sending handguns out of state?

  1. #1
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    Default Sending handguns out of state?

    Hey guys, so it's my understanding, per ATF regs, that private individuals (non-FFL holders) can send handguns out of state as long as they are sending them via UPS/Fed-Ex directly to an FFL and/or manufacturer. (See link)

    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/unli...ensed-transfer

    Is this true? The reason I ask is because last sumer I tried to send a handgun to HK-USA to have some work done on it, and I was told at the UPS store here in Fairbanks that it is an Alaskan-wide UPS policy to not handle guns from private citizens, but rather only through FFLs. Can anyone confirm if this is true? If so, does anyone know if Fed-Ex has the same policy?

    The reason I ask is because I'm making a trade with someone who lives in Oklahoma, and I'd like to avoid having to pay an FFL transfer fee twice (once for sending him my gun, and again for picking up his).

    Ay help would be appreciated.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Yep ups to dealer,factory or yourself
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    To comply with federal law you will have to ship your handgun to a dealer for the individual to pick up. You can ship via fedex or UPS. You can not ship a handgun to an unlicensed individual, it must go to a dealer, manufacturer, or be shipped from yourself to yourself. A dealer may receive a firearm from an unlicensed individual for any lawful purpose.
    "A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise, and independence to the mind."

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F-Trooper05 View Post
    . . . I was told at the UPS store here in Fairbanks that it is an Alaskan-wide UPS policy to not handle guns from private citizens . . .
    I believe this is true of the UPS Stores but not of the UPS main facilities. Here in Palmer itís 50/50 if the UPS store will take a gun or tell you about their policy and send you away to the warehouse. FedEx will take them but itís sure not cheap to go that route unless you have an account with them and can print the labels your self.

    Like the other guys said your interpretation of the laws are correct, that only gets you past the ATF though and then you got to work with the shippersí stupid rules.


    All this said the cheapest way is to have an FFL mail them through the Post Office for you, FFL can USPS them but you can't. Here in the Valley there are FFLs that will do it for $10 and postage, way cheaper than UPS/FedEx. Go to Gunbroker.com and use the FFL finder tool to find guys (they list their price) on both ends to work with. When I moved up in 2000 I shipped 19 handguns FFL to FFL for a total of $79, $20 FFL fee and postage in Arizona and $15 FFL fee in Anchorage from an APD cop that has an FFL. Finding these FFL holding fellow gun nuts guys through Gunbroker is your best bet.
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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    The law is screwy for sure.If a person from Anchorage FedX's me a handgun FedX will take it to the post office and mail it to me as they don't diliver here.Now if a person mailed it to me it could be a long road for the same action as FedX
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunbugs View Post
    A dealer may receive a firearm from an unlicensed individual for any lawful purpose.
    While this is true, my ATF inspector told me that they (ATF) are strongly discourging this practice due to the high number of stolen guns showing up on the on-line sites. A dealer has no way of knowing who he is dealing with unless he identifies the individual in person. I only accept guns from other FFL's and will not transfer a gun coming from an unidentified person. It only makes sense to me.

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowrider View Post
    While this is true, my ATF inspector told me that they (ATF) are strongly discourging this practice due to the high number of stolen guns showing up on the on-line sites. A dealer has no way of knowing who he is dealing with unless he identifies the individual in person. I only accept guns from other FFL's and will not transfer a gun coming from an unidentified person. It only makes sense to me.
    If itís legal itís none of their business and beyond their purview to ďstrongly discourageĒ any legal act. Itís one thing to point out that if an item (gun or anything of value) turns out to be stolen itís best to know who it came from but another to use their authority to ďstrongly discourageĒ a legal act.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADfields View Post
    If itís legal itís none of their business and beyond their purview to ďstrongly discourageĒ any legal act. Itís one thing to point out that if an item (gun or anything of value) turns out to be stolen itís best to know who it came from but another to use their authority to ďstrongly discourageĒ a legal act.
    You said it, AD:

    It ain't nunna their Steen'keeng business.

    ATF serves no useful, or desirable purpose, that I'm aware of.

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    Don't shoot the messenger!!

    I'm not a big ATF fan either but there are a lot of stolen guns out there and as a dealer I do not want to be involved with handling a stolen gun....thus my policy of only transfering FFL to FFL. It may be a bit more trouble to go thru a dealer but from my standpoint it is a lot safer. I would happily go back to pre-GCA of 68 so we could buy guns over the phone, mail order, at Sears and Monkey Wards, maybe we could even do 7-11.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowrider View Post
    Don't shoot the messenger!!

    I'm not a big ATF fan either but there are a lot of stolen guns out there and as a dealer I do not want to be involved with handling a stolen gun....thus my policy of only transfering FFL to FFL. It may be a bit more trouble to go thru a dealer but from my standpoint it is a lot safer. I would happily go back to pre-GCA of 68 so we could buy guns over the phone, mail order, at Sears and Monkey Wards, maybe we could even do 7-11.
    Then, what would be your policy IF we did go back to pre-GCA of 68?

    You wouldn't be involved at all, and how would you and the ATF control stolen guns then?

    Just kiddin.

    I'm curious. Is it a practice to transfer a gun coming from an unidentified person? A stolen gun?

    Smitty of the North
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    First and foremost, I don't make a living as an FFL so I don't have the same motivation as other dealers to "move" guns. I do not transfer guns from unidentifed sources, but you don't need to look too far to find a dealer that will.

    If we could go back to the pre-GCA days I would be most happy to get the Federal and/or government fingers out of the gun business and treat them as any other tool. My Dad bought my first gun for me at age 8. It was a Remington 514 and it came from a hardware store and was kept behind the counter but wasn't too far from the hammers, saws and paint brushes. Things made more sense back then. My Dad made it clear...use the gun properly or loose it and there was never a doubt in my mind. The gun went to school with me and I hunted after school and I never shot anyone. Now our nanny state won't even let kids play on the play gound...we have become a country of coddled, over weight, over protected, over regulated wooses. I'll stop right there.

    I think we all know why there are gun regulations and it is not to preserve the safety of our society. Stolen property has been and will continue to be problem in our society for a number of reasons. Guns are no different than jewelery, fine china or chain saws, just easier to spot because make, model and SN is maintained in records and entered into NCIC and other data bases when they are reported stolen.

    B&E, home invasion and robbery will continue and guns and many other things will be stolen. Perhaps if we had less defense attorneys and more Middle Eastern justice where the offending hand is removed we might see a reduction in theft in Western society.

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    Oh yeah...I forgot. If someone steals a gun from me or you, I would like to be able to identify the puke and have him/her pay for their evil ways.

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    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    I agree, I was just pointing out itís none of BATFís business until a crime is commuted. Some of them are way too big for there jack boots these days and want to go way beyond their authority. If everyone just submits to them when they are out of bounds because they donít want to tick off the all powerful wizard of oz, soon they will have that nose even farther under the tent wall asking even more stuff thatís none of their business. ATF is useless in tracking down a thief anyway, they donít care about the guy that stole a gun or two, they are looking to hang people on weapons violations not trafficking stolen goods. Just common sense to CYA with paperwork and contact info on any goods you receive, that itís a gun is irrelevant really, so long as you do the ATF paperwork itís none of their business beyond that.
    Andy
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