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Thread: Washington Senator and Pebble

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    Member AlpineEarl's Avatar
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    Default Washington Senator and Pebble

    It appears that Senator Cantwell from Washington is doing a better job of representing the wishes of most Alaskans than any of our own. Congressman Young is doing his best to collect contributions from business While Begich and Murkowski seem absent at best. Oct. is almost here and the vote is not far off. Time to choose sides, stand up and be counted.

    http://www.adn.com/2011/09/11/206225...er-pebble.html

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    Member Dirtofak's Avatar
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    It is hard for me to assume that "most" Alaskans are against Pebble Mine. I haven't seen a 100% vote yet.

    It is still early in the process and truthfully, I haven't seen anything to make me pro or con. I don't believe any of the commercials from either side. I'll wait for the rest of the story.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtofak View Post
    It is hard for me to assume that "most" Alaskans are against Pebble Mine. I haven't seen a 100% vote yet.

    It is still early in the process and truthfully, I haven't seen anything to make me pro or con. I don't believe any of the commercials from either side. I'll wait for the rest of the story.
    I'm w/ dirt on this one. Its hard for me to imagine Congressman Young want would jeopardize the BB drainage.





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    Anybody seen what tax revenues the Pebble project is forecast to generate for the state?

    Right now the mining industry does not contribute much more to the general fund than the comm fish guys - pretty pathetic for both.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

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    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak View Post
    Anybody seen what tax revenues the Pebble project is forecast to generate for the state?

    Right now the mining industry does not contribute much more to the general fund than the comm fish guys - pretty pathetic for both.
    General fund? Oh I forgot you live off other peoples taxes...nevermind





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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtofak View Post
    It is hard for me to assume that "most" Alaskans are against Pebble Mine. I haven't seen a 100&#37; vote yet.

    It is still early in the process and truthfully, I haven't seen anything to make me pro or con. I don't believe any of the commercials from either side. I'll wait for the rest of the story.
    No need to wait for it. It's a story that's been written countless times over. How it ends is not a secret. But still it seams that too few have read it, or somehow choose not to believe it. It's an easy story to follow because you can open it to any of it's hundreds of chapters and they're all the same. They have titles like Butte, Leadville, Deer Lodge, Libby, Uravan, Ward, Nighthawk, Northport, Cobalt, Soda Springs, Stockton, Eureka, Sandy..... Best is that it's non-fiction. You can actually go to any of the places in the story and see for yourself; breathe the air, if you dare; wade barefoot in the pretty iridescent water; talk to the people who live the legacy of the original authors.....

    I for one don't feel the need to hang around in the glass chamber to see what happens when they drop the tablets into the bucket of water. It's old news.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
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    Member Dirtofak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iofthetaiga View Post
    No need to wait for it. It's a story that's been written countless times over. How it ends is not a secret. But still it seams that too few have read it, or somehow choose not to believe it. It's an easy story to follow because you can open it to any of it's hundreds of chapters and they're all the same. They have titles like Butte, Leadville, Deer Lodge, Libby, Uravan, Ward, Nighthawk, Northport, Cobalt, Soda Springs, Stockton, Eureka, Sandy..... Best is that it's non-fiction. You can actually go to any of the places in the story and see for yourself; breathe the air, if you dare; wade barefoot in the pretty iridescent water; talk to the people who live the legacy of the original authors.....

    I for one don't feel the need to hang around in the glass chamber to see what happens when they drop the tablets into the bucket of water. It's old news.
    My neighbor is a geologist. The 2 professionals across the street have contracted for pebble and they are VERY environmentally consious (Talking Subaru driving, kayak paddling, composting hippies). A friend works out there as a mechanic. Not one has seen or heard of anything written in stone that has them worried. I'm thinking it is time to be concerned, not time to get panties in a wad.

    You do understand that there have been mines out there for many years.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
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    where is the mine that shut down the little sue to kings and silvers? was this a result of digging and exploring? did the adfg do a bad job? sure, easy to jump on a side and proclaim it's greatness while you spout the problems of the oppositon, quite another to stand back and take it all in. good on anyone who stands up for a cause, either side of it, quite another deal to assume that becasue you yell the loudest your opinon is correct. I don't care how it shakes out, but I vote for jobs, and all the people who say it takes 10 years plus for x, its been 10 years now, how's it goin?

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    So some in government want to impose regulations to limit economic growth. Some strategy. Clearly they're good at it. It isn't important whether you favor or oppose Pebble. This is the wrong way to address it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Don_h View Post
    where is the mine that shut down the little sue to kings and silvers? was this a result of digging and exploring? did the adfg do a bad job? sure, easy to jump on a side and proclaim it's greatness while you spout the problems of the oppositon, quite another to stand back and take it all in. good on anyone who stands up for a cause, either side of it, quite another deal to assume that becasue you yell the loudest your opinon is correct. I don't care how it shakes out, but I vote for jobs, and all the people who say it takes 10 years plus for x, its been 10 years now, how's it goin?
    No mine of even half the size of the proposed pebble has not pollulted. As iofthetiaga pointed out a simple search will point that out. The mining laws privatize profit and socialize loss. The story is old. Mine the minerals then declare bankruptcy and have taxpayers clean it up in perpetuity.

    The jobs line is old and tired and complete BS. It's a trade off. Mining jobs for fishing jobs, that's the trade. To argue a few jobs is worth the loss to commercial fishing, tourism, recreational fishing....etc. is just nieve. If an unpolluted Bristol Bay, lake Iliamna and Talarik creek mean a few miners and villagers don't get work so be it. The jobs and livelihoods of thousands is not worth the few jobs Pebble would produce. Your argument hold no water and there is nothing to take in. Mining pollution has a long and storied history in the US, it's you that needs to stand back and take an honest look.

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    As I look around me I'm surrounded by products that are made of mined materials. I believe the same can be said for every one of you, too. What's driving the mine? We are.

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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Pid View Post
    As I look around me I'm surrounded by products that are made of mined materials. I believe the same can be said for every one of you, too. What's driving the mine? We are.
    And 'we' need to stop it.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
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    Stop consuming products or stop expecting them to be affordable? You go first.

    I'm not decided about "the mine" because there's nothing to decide about yet. No plan, no size, no details. Sounds like enough uncertainty is there for the government to take decisive action. What a crock. No wonder this country is so screwed up.

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    Supporting Member iofthetaiga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Pid View Post
    Stop consuming products or stop expecting them to be affordable? You go first.
    Lots of us already way ahead of you. Try to catch up.
    ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
    I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
    The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It
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    How can anybody be against something that has not been defined yet???? I'm taking a wait and see attitude. The pipeline was going to kill the enviroment 40 years ago and I'm still waiting for that to happen. Until a decision is made on the scope of this possible mine, I'm just waiting for the end product to be designed and then I will make up my mind. NOT BEFORE BUT THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE ALREADY DECIDED HAVE SOMETHING ELSE IN PLAY, IMO.
    If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip?

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    They are against an idea whop, they don't want to face an even fight by waiting for facts.
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    "Here- hold my beer and watch what happens to these fish." - Darwin Award candidates.

    Successfully discerning the value of ideas can be important for survival.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thewhop2000 View Post
    The pipeline was going to kill the enviroment 40 years ago and I'm still waiting for that to happen. Until a decision is made on the scope of this possible mine, I'm just waiting for the end product to be designed and then I will make up my mind. NOT BEFORE BUT THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE ALREADY DECIDED HAVE SOMETHING ELSE IN PLAY, IMO.
    Worthy of a re-post and rep! Well stated Wop!

    Tim

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    Member AlpineEarl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Pid View Post
    Stop consuming products or stop expecting them to be affordable? You go first.

    I'm not decided about "the mine" because there's nothing to decide about yet. No plan, no size, no details. Sounds like enough uncertainty is there for the government to take decisive action. What a crock. No wonder this country is so screwed up.
    You are definately behind the curve. The proposal has been out for years. The exploration has already been going on and the Pebble folks have already been fined for violating the rules of their permits. You just go ahead and sit in the dark with your eyes and ears closed and the rest will pass you by as well. Here is some old news: http://www.adn.com/2010/02/12/113658...rs-to-pay.html Talk about uninformed, you need to look at all sides of the issue, not just the stuff the Pebble folks put out. Screwed up? Yep the uninformed continue to blindly follow the sheep in front of them. Catch phrases and shiny things, that all it takes for some. Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=768h3Tz4Qik

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    Thanks for the comments but I actually spend some time out there and have friends who live out there. I can see what's happening. Something like $150 million invested so far in a perfectly legal and licensed exploration on land that's alloted for mining. Sounds fair to me. Time will tell whether I support it or not.

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