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Thread: when to say when

  1. #1

    Question when to say when

    When is enough, enough or too much or not enough? Curious to know how some of you level-headed, logical and prudent folks feel about the modern technology that has come, is coming and about to come and the effects it has been, is, and will affect out our beloved sport of hunting. Is there a point that it will have a negative affect or will it matter...no holds barred? Have we already gone too far and reduced hunting to just killing... the fastest, easiest, kill at any cost attitude?

  2. #2
    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
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    not level headed or any of that other stuff you said, but in large amounts hunting has turned to killing, the amount of garunteed hunts that are being sold, high fence, ranches and stuff out there is miles ahead of where it was 20 years ago.
    There are still true sportsman out there, alot in here i think, but as a commercial set up..its basicly killing...people are paying to have the highest odd of pulling the trigger they can. if they call my references and they all say we had a great hunt and he's a sportsman and we saw game but none of us ever pulled the trigger cause he wasn't comfortable with 100 yard shooting...no one would ever book with me. They want success, a kill record, to know the money they spend ups the odds they've got at bagging and animal.
    NOW if moneys not really involved the mentatlity seems to change...people pay money, its like buying an animal, when they don't, its more like just a normal hunt...generalized.
    Www.blackriverhunting.com
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    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    I think it's unethical to use really modern technology.......laser finders, high power scopes, gore tex, etc.
    I only use 1940's and 50's technology............a small fabric covered airplane!
    I can't help being a lazy, dumb, weekend warrior.......I have a JOB!
    I have less friends now!!

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Maydog
    Were already there! Well some are, I run into guys all the time that you ask how was your hunt? Well they launch into a comercial for all the gear and gadgets they take with them. Video cameras, GPS, high speed compound bows, Gortex is old news now its this or that........it's all to gear oriented for me! By the way can't anyone else dead recon anymore? I have a GPS my father in law gave me 3 or 4 years ago I've used twice. Both times just to check myself, and before I get jummped on for this one too I can see how would be handy if you where way back in.

    I gess I'm just old fashined. I personally prefeer single shot fierarms a good map, compass and simple gear. Just me the woods and the critters. I'm not as extreem about it as my freind Fritz(he dose'nt go into the woods with anything that was'nt around in 1800) But I do prefeer a much more gear/gadget free hunt than most of the folks I know.

    Then again I'm the same way about wood working and boat biulding. One of the most enjoyable projects I ever did a customer wanted a cedar strip kayak but he did'nt want anything with a motor to ever touch it. Man what a joy that was! Took twice as long and cost him twice as much but pure heaven to do! I keep trying to talk someone into a badarka using only stone age technology but so far no takers.

    PS if you happen to be a gear junky more power to ya. And I know safer, drier, easier....blah blah blah.....I just like to be challanged alittle and too keep it simple.

    Just one really tiered Alaskans opinion.
    Rick P

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    Wink

    A piece of canvas for a coat, and my Rambo knife! Oh.. maybe a spruce branch for a belt. Matches are also a form of cheating for the true mountain man! Come to think about it the mans right the tec stuff has gotten out of hand. In the end your trying to match witts with a wild animal that has grown large by not being stupid, in a place that doesn"t allow for many mistakes! Bill Martentrapper is that a pedel power canvas plane?
    ; for them that honour me I will honour, and they that despise me shall be lightly esteemed. 1 SAMUEL 2;30

  6. #6

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    I personally have trouble shooting critters on private land aside from depredation, birds and predators. big game and big fences make me big time sick.

    one thing to consider is many states other then ak have very restrictive hunting seasons.....wa archery elk-10 days of spike or cow......and a 20 day late season in areas not holding them, wa gun elk-9 days of spike only in areas with fair density, 9 days of bull only in areas with low density, you take seasons like that and multiply it by the 300,000 hunters trying to get those 700 spike elk in 9 days and you will wish there was more technology yet.

    flip side, when on a drop hunt in areas that only see humans a few times a year if ever, you have an opportunity to actually hunt an animal vs shooting one running by with its tongue hanging out. I would take hunting in an area of lower density and tougher terrian over high numbers of critters and hunters every day of my life. I really enjoy rifle scopes that dont fog, but I like to hunt with my recurve too, a 4 wheeler saves the back a bunch, but my 99 grizzly only has 1300 miles on it just because i feel like a slob hunter if I am riding it. I am guilty as anyone, but I don't like it.

  7. #7

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    this is a tough one. where do we draw the line? way back when they used rocks, clubs, and spears. are guns too much technology? i don't know. i try to keep it simple. i mostly bowhunt, and when i gun hunt i like my encore. i have a lot of gadgets but find i don't use them too much. the range finder was cool when it came out but i have never actually used it when i hunted. i dragged it along for a while but now the most use it sees is when i am setting up an new archery range in the yard. gps' are cool but i use them when i am out exploring on my snowmachine for the most part (every thing looks the same with snow in the mts). my friends laugh but i still make my fires with flint and steel. every now and then i use a bow (lots of work there). i use modern metal treestands because the homemade wood ones have a bad track record (and i can build a house). i don't like the idea of canned hunts and i think the lazer range finding scope are a joke (they even have ones that take photos of your shot). i guess its up to the individual.

  8. #8
    Member Alaskacajun's Avatar
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    I don't see anything wrong with a scoped rifle, GPS for safety, and a set of nice binoculars on a hunt.

    ~ A nice rifle scope assures me of a clean kill.

    ~ I've never been lost in the woods, and don't plan on being anytime soon!

    ~ I enjoy glassing. Even if I don't take an animal I still have a great time just glassing! It's part of the experience.....

    - Clint

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    Well Marten Trapper, at times I use gore tex, gps, etc etc etc but none of those would compare to the effectiveness of your technology....I think that plane trumps em all. I'm still just a schmuck on the ground with a rifle and a granola bar and a flask of whiskey while I wait for game.

  10. #10

    Talking good thoughts

    I know that it comes down to personal choice when considering how much of and when and where to use modern technology. Kinda like ethics...we, and we alone dictate what, if any, that we have and will use. Safety is an area where it's probably prudent to use what we feel necessary for obvious reasons. I find for myself, more enjoyment and satisfaction, in making my hunting more challenging in keeping it simple. Going with a single shot rifle/open sight combo so I have to make it more personal...similar to the stick slingers and pistoleros, but it's just my choice. I don't want to go way back in time, but not clutter the hunt either. Just a look back 50-75 years at those boys...they got the job done very efficiently, maybe too much so, and we can't seem to live without it. But if it wasn't for gadgets, Cabela's and Sportsman's Warehouse wouldn't exist. Then, what would we have?

  11. #11
    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Two quick things;
    Wiskey on a hunt? Not till were sitin' around the campfire!
    Cabellas was around before all the junk came along, and both would do fine without the gadgets. By the way can remeber my dad and grand dad having conversations like this 30 years ago!

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    Default Whiskey on hunt

    WEll, I don't have one of those fancy schmancy range finder scopes so I use the booze to help conceptualize the needed windage I don't believe in modern medicine on a primitive hunt so it also acts as an antiseptic and pain reliever in case of injury!

  13. #13

    Default Scopes

    Does anyone remember when real men didn't use a scope? Or is it just where I grew up?

  14. #14
    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Ok maybe if your just a sipper but I've had too many bad bush experiances with boooze/drugs.... Clients falling out of drift boats....Folks too sick too fish in the morning.....Kid on acid trying to paddle clas 3/4 water..... female guides sleeping with there gun more out of concern for there clients than bears......had too ban the stuff altogether on guided trips!

  15. #15
    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    I do Anton;
    Dont really have a problem with scopes it's the range finding, photo taking, windage and ellevation calculating and light enhancing ones that get me. Saw an add for one that looked like it belonged to Luke Skywalker...

  16. #16

    Default Red tape

    I have a problem with red streamers everywhere I go. I know its helped a few people find their way out of the woods though. I always cut the stuff down and hope the person that put it there gets mad.

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default The Things We Can't Control

    When to say when? I think David Petersen addresses your question in THIS ESSAY

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    AMEN thanks Bushrat and Mr. Petersen.

  19. #19

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    I just wish people would actually learn their limits as far as marksmanship. Let them carry a rangefinder and if it says 250 when they can only hit at 200 - Pass on the shot!
    Rangefinders are a great way to improve your range estimating skills if you get out and "guess and measure" but the "range-finding, video taking, auto compensating" scopes are going to far. For any big game - if you can't see it with a 4 power scope, you ain't gonna hit it with a 16 power scope. As I get older I see the need for scopes but can't really see the need for a 12 power scope on a 375 (and they hurt too :-)
    I don't know any way to stop the increase of gadgetry, kind of think we'll have to put up with it. I don't really think anyone scores because of the gadget anyway. Woodsmanship does still count. But I will draw the line at heat seeking smart bullets :-)
    Mike
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    There is a faster way off the mountain, might hurt a little though.

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    Technology? My choice for efficient killing(I like to kill the animal before bring it home), is a Blackhawk helo, night vision, thermal imaging, using a chain gun eliminates the need to grind burger when I get home.

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